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World Merge is a fail for Elysium

JordanTheTrollJordanTheTroll
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edited September 9 in General Chat
Originally from khaini ive been asking for a world merge for years because our server was dead. Even after the world merge i still seem to find barely any people. Channel 1 isnt even full. On other servers every channel is full. How do you unevenly distribute players. This is still a failure i cant play MS if i dont have anyone to talk to. We need another world merge. ._. 5 years later and im still posting world merge threads. They cant seem to get it right.
darik

Comments

  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 9
    Honestly some people are just never going to be happy. Even if you give them what they want, some of them will still find a reason as to why it still isn't good enough.
  • JordanTheTrollJordanTheTroll
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    edited September 9
    Because the purpose of a world merge is to bring players together to form an active community. THAT DID NOT HAPPEN???
    darik
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 9
    I understand that the world merge didn't magically propel your world's population to the levels of bera or reboot in the week since it took place, but you're perpetuating the joke that maplestory players will complain about literally anything, even if you give them exactly what they asked for.

    Everyone asked for a merge for years, yes, and a merge finally happened. Here we are now, a week later, and you, my friend, are the lucky one to be the first to pitch a fit that being given exactly what you asked for was not good enough. Take care not to strain your back, I know goalposts tend to be a bit on the heavy side.
    Fuhreak
  • JordanTheTrollJordanTheTroll
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    edited September 9
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    and you, my friend, are the lucky one to be the first to pitch a fit that being given exactly what you asked for was not good enough.

    it wasnt
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 9
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Take care not to strain your back, I know goalposts tend to be a bit on the heavy side.

    Hey look I can pick and choose snippets of a post to quote too.

    Worth mentioning, as well, is that a single person does not represent a suitable sample size. One person saying an entire operation was a complete failure is seen as an outlier rather than an issue. The exception rather than the rule, if you will.
  • HuskyDMHuskyDM
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    edited September 9
    To be honest Elysium is great. I was from GRAZED and it was just as dead as others. Aurora got lucky getting merged with Windia, but still the population of Elysium its a lot better than we used to have. Now Elysium is kinda of the normal server for people who want a quieter experience but still finding people instead of the ghost ship it was before the merge.
    darikpommepouffe
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 9
    I can also attest to the fact that I've spent an hour or two on elysium most days leveling a kanna because why not. I haven't seen a single complaint about the world merge being a failure in that time.

    Plus it doesn't lag horribly like bera, so nice
  • ShadEightShadEight
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    edited September 10
    You can thank the bright people of this forum who petitioned for worlds to remain dead because they 'wanted free channels to grind with'.
    darik
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 10
    That's funny, I don't remember players ever having input on how many worlds would get merged together, or what worlds would be merged with each other. In fact, the only input players got was picking the names of the two new worlds.

    The point at play here is that Jordan seems to have believed that a world merge would be a magic fix-all; that merging worlds would somehow spike the population of the new worlds up to the levels of bera and reboot. That isn't how things work, much as you'd love to believe otherwise.

    One solution is to allow world transfers out of bera specifically and into either of the two merged worlds with the same restrictions as the previous world transfer event(which is to say, few if any). It wouldn't equalize the populations by any means, but there's potential that it would at least be a breath of life into what Jordan considers a still-dead failure-of-a-merge world.
  • JushiroNetJushiroNet
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    edited September 10
    if I were a player from broni or grazed I would not be particularly happy either.

    Sure you got a merge and it's slightly higher population so I guess that is something. However you do not have to accept the bare minimum. Your world is still dead and this is supposed to be an MMO. If you need a reminder that means the world is supposed to be populated.

    You should expect the minimum because nexon is useless but you don't have to be happy about it.
  • TwilightHimeTwilightHime
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    edited September 10
    I dunno if you want to compare to bera, given that every channel on every map you might like is full of bots.
  • FuhreakFuhreak
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    edited September 10
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Honestly some people are just never going to be happy. Even if you give them what they want, some of them will still find a reason as to why it still isn't good enough.

    This is why I personally believe the players are just as guilty in the "MapleStory is dying" argument.
    Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people. Why would anyone want to play an MMO where people are constantly complaining and saying the ship is sinking?
    Why is that a ship I want to get on? Nexon isn't perfect, far from it. But the player base really does complain way too much.
    I've played games that were actually dying, as in confirmed by the company to be removed in X number of days.
    Even in those games the players didn't complain as much as people do in MapleStory.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 10
    Fuhreak wrote: »
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Honestly some people are just never going to be happy. Even if you give them what they want, some of them will still find a reason as to why it still isn't good enough.

    This is why I personally believe the players are just as guilty in the "MapleStory is dying" argument.
    Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people. Why would anyone want to play an MMO where people are constantly complaining and saying the ship is sinking?
    Why is that a ship I want to get on? Nexon isn't perfect, far from it. But the player base really does complain way too much.
    I've played games that were actually dying, as in confirmed by the company to be removed in X number of days.
    Even in those games the players didn't complain as much as people do in MapleStory.

    I played a game where we stopped getting updates, hadn't had a single one in probably six months or so, stopped even hearing from the community manager for weeks at a time, and when we finally got the answers we so desperately wanted, they were not what any of us wanted to hear. According to this lovely community manager of ours, the game(as in the IP) was now owned by a different company, who then issued a cease-and-desist order regarding the continued running of game servers. Game servers that were then slated to be shut down December 26th, 2007. We were angry, hoo boy you better believe we were. We were angry at gala-net/gpotato for keeping us in the dark for so long and angry at Yedang for, as we thought, pulling the rug out from under us for no real reason. And even then, with imminent death, more or less, looming on the horizon, we didn't complain as much as maplestory players.
    Unrelated tangent, thus the spoiler tag. You can read up on the game here, as well as see the parting farewell from our community manager here.

    A handful of us came to find out, around 5 or 6 years later, that things weren't as cut-and-dry as we were lead to believe. Apparently the devs weren't getting their share, so they went to a larger entity for help. Now, this wouldn't be so bad, but the problem arose in claims laid out by the CM's letter linked above. In it, he claimed the following:
    Gala-Net has fought for one of two goals. Either the continuation of our service in the US complete with updates, or the voluntary transfer of your characters to a new publisher's service.

    Which sounds lovely, no? Either allow them to continue serving the game, provide them with all held-back content updates; or allow for the transfer of player data to another service. What wasn't mentioned here was that as soon as the announcement was made regarding the C&D order, they elected to kick-off a permanent event ingame that boosted exp, money and item drop rates to absurd levels. Given that most of us hit the high 80s or low 90s for level, with one even hitting cap at 100, the transfer of our data was well and truly off the table at that point. For a game based primarily around pvp, allowing players to enter a new service at effectively endgame would not have been acceptable under any circumstances.
    Fuhreak
  • JushiroNetJushiroNet
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    edited September 10
    Accept mediocrity the wise words of Aggraphine.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 10
    JushiroNet wrote: »
    Accept mediocrity the wise words of Aggraphine.

    And what would this thread look like, I wonder, if they merged all 15 worlds together and our friend Jordan over here still didn't think the post-merge population was up to his standards of "not dead"-ness?
  • HuskyDMHuskyDM
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    edited September 10
    Fuhreak wrote: »
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Honestly some people are just never going to be happy. Even if you give them what they want, some of them will still find a reason as to why it still isn't good enough.

    This is why I personally believe the players are just as guilty in the "MapleStory is dying" argument.
    Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people. Why would anyone want to play an MMO where people are constantly complaining and saying the ship is sinking?
    Why is that a ship I want to get on? Nexon isn't perfect, far from it. But the player base really does complain way too much.
    I've played games that were actually dying, as in confirmed by the company to be removed in X number of days.
    Even in those games the players didn't complain as much as people do in MapleStory.

    I'm on the "Maplestory is in a bad shape" side of the argument, not so much on the dying segment. People can be really pessimistic and that is a slippery slope. I don't agree with the "Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people" argument. Its too optimistic and pretty much anything that is considered bad can be enjoyed with friends for all the wrong reasons. Playing terrible games like Fallout 76 or No Man Sky for the laughs with friends doesn't take away the fact that those games are bad and that playing them alone will be a terrible experience.

    Now with the idea that Elysium didn't work I again state I disagree. I can agree that the population numbers are terrible still compared to the wide success of KMS, but there are several reasons for that beyond just Nexon's fault, like the fact that MMOs have gone out of style in recent years and are a mostly niche hobby with only WoW and FF14 enjoying a huge playerbase, and those are only two of the hundreds of options there are out there. Elysium did mitigate the population issues of those worlds and if you find a guild in those then it won't be an issue getting carries or people to do content with, and its much easier than the way that they were before. I have finally found people going around on a consistent basis outside of CH1, something impossible before the merge. Should there be a server jump to balance numbers out? I don't think so really. Now we have 4 worlds with a decreasing curve in population and this is great for the new players so they can decide if they want to go to the most crowded world or the least.

    Nexon still has several issues they need to work with though, bots are still prevalent, servers are still unstable and they fail to communicate what they are doing, if anything, beyond their band-aid Fury Totem solutions. Is Maple dying because of those? Not really. Is the experience good with all of that? You mileage might vary but given that we still have players that come back to play and make content on I wouldn't say its all bad, just in bad shape and meeting bots constantly can hit your motivation really hard. Besides those who have permanent NX nostalgia glasses that fail to see Maple beyond the Pre Big-Bang era, or those who prefer to complain about everything won't realize how much the game has improved and will never stop complaining that the game is dying.

    At least they listened us with the world merge.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited September 10
    HuskyDM wrote: »
    Fuhreak wrote: »
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Honestly some people are just never going to be happy. Even if you give them what they want, some of them will still find a reason as to why it still isn't good enough.

    This is why I personally believe the players are just as guilty in the "MapleStory is dying" argument.
    Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people. Why would anyone want to play an MMO where people are constantly complaining and saying the ship is sinking?
    Why is that a ship I want to get on? Nexon isn't perfect, far from it. But the player base really does complain way too much.
    I've played games that were actually dying, as in confirmed by the company to be removed in X number of days.
    Even in those games the players didn't complain as much as people do in MapleStory.

    I'm on the "Maplestory is in a bad shape" side of the argument, not so much on the dying segment. People can be really pessimistic and that is a slippery slope. I don't agree with the "Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people" argument. Its too optimistic and pretty much anything that is considered bad can be enjoyed with friends for all the wrong reasons. Playing terrible games like Fallout 76 or No Man Sky for the laughs with friends doesn't take away the fact that those games are bad and that playing them alone will be a terrible experience.

    Now with the idea that Elysium didn't work I again state I disagree. I can agree that the population numbers are terrible still compared to the wide success of KMS, but there are several reasons for that beyond just Nexon's fault, like the fact that MMOs have gone out of style in recent years and are a mostly niche hobby with only WoW and FF14 enjoying a huge playerbase, and those are only two of the hundreds of options there are out there. Elysium did mitigate the population issues of those worlds and if you find a guild in those then it won't be an issue getting carries or people to do content with, and its much easier than the way that they were before. I have finally found people going around on a consistent basis outside of CH1, something impossible before the merge. Should there be a server jump to balance numbers out? I don't think so really. Now we have 4 worlds with a decreasing curve in population and this is great for the new players so they can decide if they want to go to the most crowded world or the least.

    Nexon still has several issues they need to work with though, bots are still prevalent, servers are still unstable and they fail to communicate what they are doing, if anything, beyond their band-aid Fury Totem solutions. Is Maple dying because of those? Not really. Is the experience good with all of that? You mileage might vary but given that we still have players that come back to play and make content on I wouldn't say its all bad, just in bad shape and meeting bots constantly can hit your motivation really hard. Besides those who have permanent NX nostalgia glasses that fail to see Maple beyond the Pre Big-Bang era, or those who prefer to complain about everything won't realize how much the game has improved and will never stop complaining that the game is dying.

    At least they listened us with the world merge.

    I think No Man's Sky has slowly been getting to a good place, one at which people can actually play the game because it feels worth more than five minutes of memeing. Fallout 76, on the other hand, is still a dumpster fire worthy of little but derision.

    As to your point about gms vs kms population, the biggest factor to that is that, culturally, Korean players tend to gravitate more toward this type of game, while over here in the US, for example, people tend to gravitate more toward single-purchase games or team-based things, rather than persistent online environments.

    Agree on your population curve point as well, not everyone wants a clusterfuck like bera. Some people like a somewhat quieter server. Never mind that half of bera's perceived population is literally bots. But that problem may well solve itself if the kishin changes that tms and cms got today ever make it to gms. The spawn increase was removed and replaced with a 10% exp bonus. As for the fury totem, I have many opinions about that, all of them negative.
  • FuhreakFuhreak
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    edited September 10
    HuskyDM wrote: »
    I'm on the "Maplestory is in a bad shape" side of the argument, not so much on the dying segment. People can be really pessimistic and that is a slippery slope. I don't agree with the "Even a bad game is worth playing with the right people" argument. Its too optimistic and pretty much anything that is considered bad can be enjoyed with friends for all the wrong reasons. Playing terrible games like Fallout 76 or No Man Sky for the laughs with friends doesn't take away the fact that those games are bad and that playing them alone will be a terrible experience.

    The point I was trying to make is, because everyone is constantly bashing these games, no one wants to play them.
    Meanwhile even games that are bad, if enough people talk about them, you can still get people to play them.
    Word of mouth is a lot more of a powerful tool than people give credit to. The only word about MapleStory seems to be that it's a death trap.
    That isn't attractive for new players. This is why I would argue that, even if it's not as productive, you should be using the party system.

    For the OP:
    If you really want to fix population issues, the best way is to actually be a welcoming community.
    No amount of world merges will fix population issues magically. People still have to want to play the game.
    You don't have to stop bashing Nexon, I know I won't. But try to give as much praise as you do bashing.
    You'll find it makes you a more happy person to stop talking negative all the time.
  • wthNoIDwthNoID
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    edited September 10
    Originally from khaini ive been asking for a world merge for years because our server was dead. Even after the world merge i still seem to find barely any people. Channel 1 isnt even full. On other servers every channel is full. How do you unevenly distribute players. This is still a failure i cant play MS if i dont have anyone to talk to. We need another world merge. ._. 5 years later and im still posting world merge threads. They cant seem to get it right.

    its not fail... it worked out nicely... well at 1st their was alot people in both nameless town and main maple town...
    but issue is their not all consistent to how it used to be alot people go afk and or decide not to log in every day

    big part is maplestory players used to focus on rare items and collectables such as chairs while now more people focus on leveling
    paired with how current game is leveling is pretty easy past most mobs with rare and unique gear drops (making drops alot rarer) and higher leveled content doesnt exactly supply rare drops anymore

    and with gach re-balance while back it kinda made most chairs way to common

    still simi active more so then before merge but now its more right place right time...

    but as a player... to another player... if you want more active people on the world you play... best thing you can do... is simply tell the people you know to play it and try it
    maple kinda has something for everyone and a class for almost every playstyle
    most people kinda overlook that now and just focus on leveling and it kinda removes fun doing so
  • rizariza
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    edited September 10
    Originally from khaini ive been asking for a world merge for years because our server was dead. Even after the world merge i still seem to find barely any people. Channel 1 isnt even full. On other servers every channel is full. How do you unevenly distribute players. This is still a failure i cant play MS if i dont have anyone to talk to. We need another world merge. ._. 5 years later and im still posting world merge threads. They cant seem to get it right.

    Hello, Jordan the troll as a fellow troll I can relate to your pain. I think your concern makes sense and is good concern the problem is if anyone cared they would of done something.

    Back during the last world transfer I too was a khaini player and had my own guild and alliance, during the announcement of the world transfers a lot of guild leaders planned and made arrangements to go to bera so the money hungry players would stick around. this, in turn, forced a lot of people to leave.

    A lot of players who were already funded and had a good guild structure was able to remain in their worlds as they had the bossers and resources to function without a market. Some to majority of them didn't which forced a lot of people to move to bera.

    Nexon knew this and could have prevented it, and even after the damage was done hasn't really fixed the issue in a timely fashion. as a khaini player and a long-time player and veteran it pains me that this happened and a lot of good friendships and bonds were broken to due bad event planning and money-hungry players.

    People don't play maple anymore for the fun of it as we used too they play for the wrong reasons and yeah even doing a world merge now people already quit this should have happened the Christmas of the year they made that mistake. But this can be a lesson to game providers and owners to listen and care for your community as they are the life line of the game.