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[REQUEST] Can we get Additional Options please?

Randomcity2Randomcity2
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edited October 2016 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
Can you guys just modify the additional options system to include a pay method (like making the fragments needed for crafting only in cash shop) while leaving the rest of the system untouched for the benefit of both pay to play users lining your pockets with cash for a constant supply of better flames and free to play users with flames dropped from bosses?

Request made. . . now on with explainations:

1. What are Flames and what is the Additional Options system?

The additional options system is a replacement and improvement on the random stats (below average, average and above average by something like 0 - 5 stat values) that used to be (and still is on some items) decided at item generation when equips dropped from mobs and bosses before the Unleashed patch back in GMS v137 (June 2013). Items around before this patch are called season 1 equipment and do not automatically have additional options added to them. Items obtained during and after this patch are marked with a white dot in the top left corner of their Item UI when moused over and are called season 2 equipment and automatically have 1 - 4 additional options decided upon item creation, with boss equips always having 4 options. Nebulites are the GMS exclusive system originally meant to replace this. Additional Options are based on equipment level and a ranking system of the level of additional options given, and so far there has only been seen rank 1 up to rank 7 in KMS, with rank 7 being the highest stat gains.

The options include but are not limited to the following:
An increase to one of the four main stats (STR / DEX / INT / LUK)
An increase to two of the four main stats (STR / DEX / INT / LUK)
An increase to Weapon Attack or Magic Attack on Armors (not affected by equipment level)
An increase to Weapon Attack or Magic Attack on Weapons (based on a formula and base attack / magic attack)
An increase to base MaxHP or MaxMP

Special Options are as follows:
An increase in %All Stats
An increase in "Boss Monster Damage + xx%"
An increase in "Damage: +xx%"
Equipment Required Level plus or minus xx levels

Resurrection Flames, or just flames for short, are a use tab item, similar to miracle cubes that are used to randomly change additional options or add them to season 1 equips. They come in two major varieties, crafted and boss drops, with boss drop ones coming in various equipment required level restrictions and from various bosses corresponding to the level of difficulty and/or suggested entry level. Usage of flames makes tradeable equips untradeable with a scissors count of 5 available trades added in KMS, but not in EMS / MSEA who decided against the requirement of silver scissors to move around flamed equips. Crafted flames, Eternal and Fierce Flames of Rebirth (similar to Meister and Master Craftsman cubes) are made by Meister and Master Craftsman level Accessory Smiths and do not have equipment level restrictions. Fierce Flames of Rebirth are similar to master craftsman cubes in being the not as good option of the two crafted items . . . they have a higher chance of level 4 or higher options instead of level 1 - 3 compared to flames obtained as boss drops. Eternal Flames of rebirth would be similar to Meister's Cube and are made by Meister level accessory smiths, they are GUARANTEED to give you level 4 or higher additional options when using them. Would be nice to unlock these in event shops as free occasional sources of crafted flames instead of locking them up and/or replacing them in event shops, Gachapon and other random rewards systems like Polo & Frito's bounty hunter portal and pouches.
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Check out this link for more detailed information


2. Why would anyone want this system added to GMS? (more like unlocked really, because its in data already)

Here's a poke at you big spenders, though it applies to everyone technically: Do you know how the Star Force system works when adding weapon attack and magic attack to your weapons? What do you think would happen if you got say ... a 55 weapon attack boost to your Fafnir Penitent Tears (two handed sword, could replace with desperado, katana, two handed blunt or two handed axe in this example going by base attack) BEFORE you add Star Force to it? You would end up with final gain of 73 attack at 15 stars compared to another copy of the same weapon that didn't have that 55 attack boost at the start from additional options, assuming both were scrolled with 9th Anniversary Prime Scroll for Two-Handed Weapons (or one handed in the case of desperado) @ 447 attack with 15 stars and additional options vs 374 attack with just 15 stars.

The system works as follows when adding attack or magic attack:
The next star to be applied to your weapon will add attack and magic attack based on the total amount that it
currently has from scrolling, additional options and previously added stars, the brackets being as follows - +1 attack / m. attack on next star (current total is 0 - 49), +2 attack / m. attack on next star (current total is 50 - 99), +3 attack / m. attack on next star (current total is 100 - 149), +4 attack on next star (current total is 150 - 199), +5 attack / m. attack on next star (current total is 200 - 249), +6 attack / m. attack on next star (current total is 250 - 299) and I think you should see the pattern by now

Back to poking at the peeps that keep the servers afloat directly or indirectly by getting others to fork out cash in their place (*cough**cough* MESOS POWER *cough**cough*) You know how you like to have dem 4% all stat nebs on all your accessories and armors? What happens if you were to replace that with 4 lines of additional options as follows: one line of just your main stat, and three lines of additional options for your main stat plus one of the other 3 stats? (Ex. 48 STR / 24 STR & DEX / 24 STR & INT / 24 STR & LUK for a total of 120 STR on a level 150 item) Wouldn't that actually end up giving you MORE range than a 4% all stat neb? Or ... well ... I guess you could aim for 6 or 7% all stat and 3 other random options, like STR increase or attack or STR + DEX ...

As to the weapon you could try to aim for something like Lv. 6 attack boost (like 55 on a two-handed fafnir sword), Lv. 6 boss damage for 12% boss, Lv. 6 Total Damage for "Damage: +6%" and Lv. 6 STR boost for 48 STR (maybe Lv. 6 All Stats boost for 6% all stats) as your four options which is relatively OP compared to a 25% boss neb that it would originally replace, though I'd like to see both systems side by side cause of stuff like skill or utility nebs ... Keep in mind that aiming for the above combination would likely be as toxic to your wallet as Bonus Potential cubes if NexonNA ever releases this to GMS, which is perfectly alright with me as long as we get them PERIOD

Poking at the Average Joe here ... go farm your @$$ off and grind dem bosses for flames to drop and flame all your $#e+ for lvl 1- 3, maybe a few options at lvl 4 or 5 for what is actually a bigger relative difference in damage before and after flames than the big spenders if you aim for good lines and farm a lot to hit them with a bit of luck + event and other seasonal / occasional sources of crafted flames like gachapon and marvel machine, free market, Oz and hunting systems like Polo & Frito or Elite monsters and bosses.
  1. Would you approve of having the additional options system added along side the Nebulite system?18 votes
    1. Yes I would like to have both Additional Options and Nebulites
       56% (10 votes)
    2. I would like to have additional options but have nebulites removed and / or discontinued
       22% (4 votes)
    3. I do not want the additional options system added, but would like Nebulite system improved
       11% (2 votes)
    4. Things are fine as they are now, stop bringing this topic up over and over
       11% (2 votes)

Comments

  • Randomcity2Randomcity2
    Reactions: 910
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    edited October 2016
    3. Why is this not currently implemented if its already in the code?

    Simple ... its a completely free damage boost system and as such gets locked down and expunged from the game like cancer because NexonNA like money ... a lot ...

    Solution? Add a pay to win element for the premium quality stuff. . . the crafting system for flames, because you KNOW that there MUST BE a reasonable and constant money flow from a pay-to-win element added to this before NexonNA will ever change their minds on treating this like a plague to be eradicated with strong medicine.

    My take on this would be to kill the extraction of boss flames system similarly to how extracted cubes was killed by replacing occult cube drops with cube fragments directly, but by locking down an alchemists ability to extract or make an extractor for flames, and placing the extracted fragments in the cash shop right next to premium fusion tickets and large bundles in marvel machine and, with whole flames added back to Gachapon (they are supposed to be there by original coding), and to philosopher books and other seasonal "boxes" like them, and of course allow them to show up in the event coin shops instead of removing / replacing them as is currently done.


    Okay ... thread started by me to take the heat off "a certain someone" from dem Mods . . . blast away with your wall of text on how you'd add a CONSTANT money source pay to win system to this or anyone else that has an idea on a pay option to get Nexon to finally allow this system in game. Thoughts on why or why you don't want the additional options system is of course free to be posted here as this is an AO & Flames thread.
  • gamechangergamechanger
    Reactions: 3,460
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    edited October 2016
    Randomcity2

    3. Why is this not currently implemented if its already in the code?

    Simple ... its a completely free damage boost system and as such gets locked down and expunged from the game like cancer because NexonNA like money ... a lot ...

    That's not actually true. GMS client is chock full of stuff that was never even intended to be implemented (S nebs, Hekaton data, CMS exclusive equips, unfinished codex sets, flames etc....). The client is just a copy paste of other regions pretty much, with a bunch of spaghetti code on their servers to decide what we actually can and cannot access.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2016
    Nebs Existed way before Additional potions system even existed, No it was not released to replace Additional options

    Nebulites were released around May of 2012, AO came into existence around December of 2012.
  • DaxterbeerDaxterbeer
    Reactions: 6,805
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    edited October 2016
    Randomcity2

    3. Why is this not currently implemented if its already in the code?

    Simple ... its a completely free damage boost system and as such gets locked down and expunged from the game like cancer because NexonNA like money ... a lot ...

    Solution? Add a pay to win element for the premium quality stuff. . . the crafting system for flames, because you KNOW that there MUST BE a reasonable and constant money flow from a pay-to-win element added to this before NexonNA will ever change their minds on treating this like a plague to be eradicated with strong medicine.

    My take on this would be to kill the extraction of boss flames system similarly to how extracted cubes was killed by replacing occult cube drops with cube fragments directly, but by locking down an alchemists ability to extract or make an extractor for flames, and placing the extracted fragments in the cash shop right next to premium fusion tickets and large bundles in marvel machine and, with whole flames added back to Gachapon (they are supposed to be there by original coding), and to philosopher books and other seasonal "boxes" like them, and of course allow them to show up in the event coin shops instead of removing / replacing them as is currently done.


    Okay ... thread started by me to take the heat off "a certain someone" from dem Mods . . . blast away with your wall of text on how you'd add a CONSTANT money source pay to win system to this or anyone else that has an idea on a pay option to get Nexon to finally allow this system in game. Thoughts on why or why you don't want the additional options system is of course free to be posted here as this is an AO & Flames thread.
    The Eternal Flames and Powerful Flames ingredients should not only be limited to the P2W, but be available to those who harvest a lot. The Mysterious Herbs should have a decent drop rate for the "flame part" or the Eternal/ Powerful Flame (the one you need 5 of similar to how you need 5 cubic blades to make a cube.) I would also be happy to put these ingredients into the bosses of Commerci Voyages.

    But in order for Nexon to make revenue, the flame "cubics" could come in bundles or 5, 10 or 20 in Gachapon. Placing whole flames into Gachapon will just kill the purpose of crafting flames. Even if the rich obtains a lot flame ingredients, they would need to craft them to the actual flames. The free to play players can still craft these flames as they won't be behind a paywall. Gachapon would be like a shortcut for ingredients like how someone LOVES sushi, but hates fishing because of the hassle. At the end, whether you caught the fish by line/net or you were in a seafood auction in Japan (its expensive to get that fatty tuna,) you need a Sushi Chef to slice the fish.



  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited October 2016
    God just stop already.
    JorjaxUzume
  • IvangoldIvangold
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    edited October 2016
    I don't know if we would get, there would be some pennalty in something we already have, we got more chance to tier eqps, some exclusive stuff are really usefull(Commerci and gollux), nebs, more chance to get bonus pot on drop(mostly useless tought), codex.

    I still think a neb revamp would be easyer and better, it would be basically like some EMS players comming in the merge, now came with more tier up and nebs besides 15+stars and flames, a unfair advantage.
  • AKradianAKradian
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    edited October 2016
    Randomcity2


    Okay ... thread started by me to take the heat off "a certain someone" from dem Mods . . .
    Wait, so you really think it's a personal issue that made KThxBaiNao tell dax "We appreciate your suggestions, however, we have already stated in previous threads that there are no current plans to implement the Flames of Rebirth," and lock his thread?
    You truly believe that if you post it you'll get a different response?
    Especially when your post is all "the only reason we're not getting AO is greedy Nexon's insatiable greed"? Yeah, that's going to put them in a good mood towards you, that's for sure...

    SMH

    On topic: I am vehemently opposed to any system that will make the game even more pay2win and increase the damage gap.
    The correct solution to the insane damage requirements coming with V bosses is not to allow our players to pay even more to get even further ahead of the non-payers. It's to reduce those bosses' (and mobs'?) HP so that we can take them on with "only" the power currently available to us plus the new V mechanisms.
  • DaxterbeerDaxterbeer
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    edited October 2016
    AKradian
    AKradian said:

    Randomcity2


    Okay ... thread started by me to take the heat off "a certain someone" from dem Mods . . .
    Wait, so you really think it's a personal issue that made KThxBaiNao tell dax "We appreciate your suggestions, however, we have already stated in previous threads that there are no current plans to implement the Flames of Rebirth," and lock his thread?
    You truly believe that if you post it you'll get a different response?
    Especially when your post is all "the only reason we're not getting AO is greedy Nexon's insatiable greed"? Yeah, that's going to put them in a good mood towards you, that's for sure...

    SMH

    On topic: I am vehemently opposed to any system that will make the game even more pay2win and increase the damage gap.
    The correct solution to the insane damage requirements coming with V bosses is not to allow our players to pay even more to get even further ahead of the non-payers. It's to reduce those bosses' (and mobs'?) HP so that we can take them on with "only" the power currently available to us plus the new V mechanisms.
    There is a 10b cap that even very few Koreans can meet because of their resources whether it is funds, 25 stars etc. The damage cap almost eliminated unless you count the $300k spender who hit the end. Dialing down bosses will make the funded feel cheated after spending that much NX (and I am not rich, but I do use a lot of free resources in the game.) The game shouldn't put a cap on players' progress if they have the funds.

    The idea of the damage gap is just stupid. It is pointless to not allow something because it benefits the rich more than the poor even though it targets everyone. There are some players who don't scroll or cube or even trying so they should not be included in the equation. Players who make use of Reward Points, dailies and events are who you be considered "Free to Play." Remember: Maplestory is a game, and games are about competition. If people cannot stand the idea that they themselves are losing, they shouldn't be playing the game.

    For the record, me and Randomcity have been discussing this long before the other thread existed. We want to help players gain range (the players who are using everything the game has to offer before using NX.) The only reason we mention P2W is not to lengthen the gap, but to take into consideration that Nexon does have to gain revenue. We are not billionaires who are making plans that cater to the rich to gain range, but for those who do are actually PLAYING the game.
  • JorjaxJorjax
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    edited October 2016
    Please god.. no...

    The only things we need is better RNG for iCoG and CoG...

    I can't imagine seeing 500+ attack boots/glove/etc or whatever.. you name it in the game with just flames alone.

    Recently, I saw a player who finally managed to hit nearly 150+ ATK/Matk 200+ all stats Aquarius crown... such glory and yet... wasted of money for return scrolls. We really need better RNG system for iCoG and CoG instead.
  • Randomcity2Randomcity2
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    edited October 2016
    Catooolooo

    Nebs Existed way before Additional potions system even existed, No it was not released to replace Additional options

    Nebulites were released around May of 2012, AO came into existence around December of 2012.
    I think you're forgetting one VERY important detail in all this . . . EVERY SINGLE BIT OF CONTENT COME TO US THROUGH THE HANDS OF KOREAN DEVELOPERS. And i do mean EVERYTHING. Yes, KMS doesn't have it in their servers, but that's because they decided to make this GMS exclusive content as each region should have SOMETHING unique about it so as to make it worth playing in one region over another preference wise to those that can get around language and region barriers if they so choose. The "developer team" stationed in each region are nothing more than emergency fixers to stop any game breaking issues that come up until mother KMS gives them a solution from the team stationed in NexonKorea HQ that is assigned to their regions content. Another very important thing to note about the nebulite system is that it clearly states and very much means exactly what it says when you see that line that says your nebulite is going to add xxx line of BONUS POTENTIAL to your equip with an empty socket (hence the crappy flat stat amounts). Additional options on the other hand is a major upgrade on the random stat system that was in place before the Unleashed patch. They are counted as being either or replacements of the other because at the end of they day, they provide nearly the same amount of power boost assuming we have reasonable access to nebulites of all ranks, but particularly S rank for near equal maximum results, with nebulites still coming in behind in power(damage) but ahead in utility.

    Now the reason I say it needs a pay to win option added is because, think about it, they DIDN'T need to have a pay wall in the nebulite system through premium fusion tickets, only the alien cubes for changing your nebulite's stats as a pay option for the big spenders would have been enough to line nexon's pockets with a decent flow of cash. And yet they did do it. . . why? .. .they like money as much as they may want to deny it here in the NexonNA region, they admitted it at Nexon Korea and promised to change their ways ... not that you should really believe they will for long ... back on topic. I didn't say it'd be impossible to craft without paying, just that a constant source would be only from the cash shop. They could also have the flame fragments drop from bosses much like cube fragments do since you only get maybe 1 - 3 cube fragments from a boss fight usually, if its not gollux, and yet you would get 5 maybe 7 occult cubes from Root Abyss bosses in KMS which would turn into an equal number of cube fragments or maybe more, making the direct drop a nerf actually. And the real free to play user, those that farm their butt's off to make good use of the rewards points system, crafting system and event shops to get to get at least 500k clean range if not 1m+ range (or even 2m ~ 2m range if they've played long enough ) through time, effort and game play such as being a merchant in the free market without breaking ToS. To you users that do such, you guys are the real free to play users and are the ones that will benefit greatly from the boss dropped flames regularly with event shops and the free market augmenting your supply of flames with the crafted flames for occasional jump starts to your presumably constant efforts with boss drops. More so than the nebulite system as A rank nebulites are actually what should be the good stuff for free players while S rank was meant to be the one behind a pay wall most of the time, other than events and free market usage. So don't hate on it please . . . we should have additional options added and they WILL benefit the real free to play users a lot even with a pay wall of sorts added on the crafting of flames for yourself.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2016
    Randomcity2

    too big to quote.
    I didnt forget that everything come from KMS, but it seriously was not a system to replace AO, they function differently other than the obvious "they add stats to equips" feature, With AO you can add stats to equips that for nebs would only be restricted to your weapon such as attack (not % attack but still), they are just fundamentally different and were not created as a replacement. Nebs are just another upgrade system that KMS never got/ released.

    It's like saying Monster collection is a replacement for the Crusader Codex or Vice versa, or Kanna's link skill should be a replacement for DA's link skill.. etc.

    I'm not Hating on AO, As i have said previously I would love for this system to be added; however, Nexon NA clearly has no intentions of it touching NA run servers.

    I also dont like people giving out incorrect information, as GMS management said previously they were not adding it because they "didnt know how to correctly implement it for NA" and the non-scissor version didnt exist until it was released properly in EU.
  • Randomcity2Randomcity2
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    edited October 2016
    Catooolooo

    Randomcity2

    too big to quote.
    I didnt forget that everything come from KMS, but it seriously was not a system to replace AO, they function differently other than the obvious "they add stats to equips" feature, With AO you can add stats to equips that for nebs would only be restricted to your weapon such as attack (not % attack but still), they are just fundamentally different and were not created as a replacement. Nebs are just another upgrade system that KMS never got/ released.

    It's like saying Monster collection is a replacement for the Crusader Codex or Vice versa, or Kanna's link skill should be a replacement for DA's link skill.. etc.

    I'm not Hating on AO, As i have said previously I would love for this system to be added; however, Nexon NA clearly has no intentions of it touching NA run servers.

    I also dont like people giving out incorrect information, as GMS management said previously they were not adding it because they "didnt know how to correctly implement it for NA" and the non-scissor version didnt exist until it was released properly in EU.
    You pulled a tl;dr there didnt' you . . . ok . .i'll shorten it here:

    End of the day, assuming you have access to everything, nebulites come out a little behind in power but ahead in utility compared to additional options. Nebulites are BONUS POTENTIAL while Additional options are a major upgrade to the random stats system from before the Unleashed patch. Because they have similar levels of power boost assuming full access, Nexon is allowed to claim that its an either or thing replacement as a valid, though flimsy, excuse as to why they have not allowed us to have additional options. Capiche? I know they're totally different in implementation, but the end results say they're comparable and thus an interchangeable excuse applies.
  • DaxterbeerDaxterbeer
    Reactions: 6,805
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    edited October 2016
    Catooolooo

    Randomcity2

    too big to quote.
    I didnt forget that everything come from KMS, but it seriously was not a system to replace AO, they function differently other than the obvious "they add stats to equips" feature, With AO you can add stats to equips that for nebs would only be restricted to your weapon such as attack (not % attack but still), they are just fundamentally different and were not created as a replacement. Nebs are just another upgrade system that KMS never got/ released.

    It's like saying Monster collection is a replacement for the Crusader Codex or Vice versa, or Kanna's link skill should be a replacement for DA's link skill.. etc.

    I'm not Hating on AO, As i have said previously I would love for this system to be added; however, Nexon NA clearly has no intentions of it touching NA run servers.

    I also dont like people giving out incorrect information, as GMS management said previously they were not adding it because they "didnt know how to correctly implement it for NA" and the non-scissor version didnt exist until it was released properly in EU.
    The ideal version of flames is to not have the scissor count like in EMS and MSEA and being able to craft them when you find the flame ingredients in Mysterious Herbs. I was also thinking about adding flame materials to Commerci Voyage as well as Elite Drops as well to be somewhat on par with cube crafting. If Nexon is worried about not having money after they add the system, we planned to implement a bit of p2w just to compromise with Nexon instead of making a free system to rob them.

    Sometimes, Nexon has Magnificent Souls in Marvel and in (Gach?) The Unrelenting Flames, (the cubic versions of flames) should follow that rule. They can both be obtained with or without NX. The Meister Master Cubes and Black and Red Cubes aren't equal due to Black and Reds beating the Meister and Master in every aspect and them not being available outside the Cash/Reward Shops. The craftable flames don't have "cash cousins." If Nexon wanted to rack up some revenue from the system, they can bundle the flame ingredients. The reason not to put the whole flames into the Gachapons is to make accessory crafting viable.










  • Randomcity2Randomcity2
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    edited October 2016
    umm ... wouldn't you just have to set the rate of obtaining whole flames to something low like the rate of obtaining a Lightning God Ring from gachapon, just not as low, with bundles of crafting materials at about the rate of getting A rank nebulites from gachapon to control the amount that comes random rewards systems to keep them as sources of flames while making accessory crafting still viable due to low chance to get them outside of crafting or event coin shops?
  • gamechangergamechanger
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    edited October 2016
    I would like to see AO be brought over (and Nebs also revamped), but I've also accepted that it won't happen