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Should Toggle skills be on by default?? (no bait)

DiscordOfColorsDiscordOfColors
Reactions: 965
Posts: 45
Member
edited May 2017 in General Chat
i believe i speak in the name of all wind archers when i say this; toggle skills should be on by default and keep the option to be turned off/on like they do now.

as a wind archer since the cygnus revamp at ~2014 (in ems) and a veteran player since 2006 (both ems and gms) i've gone through a lot, from passive skills to buffs to toggles to passives again, and i see the need for toggle for skills like "teleport mastery" for mages or "body pressure" for arans, where you wouldn't necessarily want to draw monster aggro on your way to a map, because they might knock you off ladders with ranged attacks or similar scenarios, but wind archers are not in the same category, for if we take off our toggle (trifling wind) we lose approximately 40% of our damage input. 40% is a big deal to lose. it means i would have to do bosses for 1.66x times longer per boss if say i accidentally forget to put it on or just logged in and had to do something real quick in real life. it also means i would have to use an extra "buff" every time i die, for example, while doing bosses like magnus where you don't really have the extra 1~2 seconds to buff up before you dive right in to the fight. unless you want to risk dying again.

my suggestion or request would be to either have toggles on through deaths and log offs or to have them on by default when logging in.

edit: i thought i could somehow make the poll have 2 options checked but i guess not.
  1. should toggles be on by default?21 votes
    1. On when logging in
       57% (12 votes)
    2. Off when logging in
       5% (1 vote)
    3. Have it on/off through deaths
       19% (4 votes)
    4. It's fine as it is
       19% (4 votes)

Comments

  • RollsRolls
    Reactions: 3,220
    Posts: 177
    Member
    edited May 2017
    There wasn't anything wrong with trifling wind being a passive when it was. It's not like it does anything by itself you wouldn't want it to in certain situations. There is legitimately no benefit to turning it off. When they made it a toggle, it honestly just appeared that they wanted one more thing to be possible to forget and another thing to have to turn on after dying. There's more toggles like this that would be better off just being passives, as they used to be. It's only counterproductive to turn most passives into toggles.
    DiscordOfColors
  • OdysseyTwoOdysseyTwo
    Reactions: 2,550
    Posts: 223
    Member, Private Tester
    edited August 2017
    Rolls wrote: »
    There's more toggles like this that would be better off just being passives, as they used to be. It's only counterproductive to turn most passives into toggles.

    From Maple Ice & Burn (Called FIREPOWER in GMS):
    on-off-skills.png
    For many classes which have passive skills that are automatically activated while attacking, it might lead to some frustration at some places. (One of these "places" is Chaos Pierre) Therefore, the following jobs have had some skills changed into On/Off skills.

    Night Lord‘s Mark of Assassin
    EunWol’s Fox Spirit
    Angelic Buster‘s Soul Seeker Expert
    Night Walker‘s Shadow Bats
    Xenon‘s Aegis System
    Archmage (F/P)‘s Ignite
    [Wind Archer's Trifling Wind] (From a future update as an undocumented change)
    [Xenon's Pinpoint Salvo] (From a future update as a rework)

    So Ice & Burn's Toggle Skill resolution was actually a terrible change. I honestly thought it was a very great change, but in hindsight, most of these Final Attack-like skills only activate when you attack. In fact, KMS should have realized that if a class has Final Attack or similar, they would never accidentally draw monster aggro on your way to a map if they don't attack. Kinesis' Kinetic Combo works similarly to the above mentioned skills, except it is a passive skill. When KMS was creating Kinesis, they figured that if you don't attack, Kinetic Combo won't activate, so they left it as a passive skill, rather than a toggle skill. Kinetic Combo is solid evidence for why most of the above skills should be reverted back to passive skills.
    The only skill that was worth changing into a toggle was Xenon's Aegis System, which instead activates from getting hit by or dodging an enemy attack. In other words, it is a counterattack skill, which often draws monster aggro on your way to a map, so they are better off as toggle skills. Having said that, Cannoneer's Counter Crush should be changed to a toggle skill, because Hayato's Eye for an Eye got to be changed from a passive skill to a toggle skill.
    in b4 thread moved to suggestion category
  • JushiroNetJushiroNet
    Reactions: 5,950
    Posts: 747
    Member, Private Tester
    edited May 2017
    This is probably part of a larger question of buff saving on logout/login.

    I personally believe all buffs should be saved instead of just exp ones. If this were the case toggles would still be on if you had them on.
    AKradianIts2Sharp4U
  • AKradianAKradian
    Reactions: 39,625
    Posts: 6,129
    Volunteer Forum Moderator, Private Tester
    edited May 2017
    All those skills became toggles rather than passives because there are situations in which you are attacking some mobs, but do not want random missiles flying around and attacking other mobs. For example, Chaos Pierre.

    However, I do think toggles should keep their setting through logout/disconnect and death.
  • OdysseyTwoOdysseyTwo
    Reactions: 2,550
    Posts: 223
    Member, Private Tester
    edited May 2017
    AKradian wrote: »
    All those skills became toggles rather than passives because there are situations in which you are attacking some mobs, but do not want random missiles flying around and attacking other mobs. For example, Chaos Pierre.

    OK... Name another example where it's better to turn these skills off.
  • DiscordOfColorsDiscordOfColors
    Reactions: 965
    Posts: 45
    Member
    edited May 2017
    DeeMon wrote: »
    It's not even that big of a deal, just press the key, dood.

    it honestly is. this is a problem i've been keeping silent about ever since the change but ask 90% of wind archer community and they will agree. having 40% of your dps cut is really annoying especially when there's no animation for it and i need a firm press or multiple presses, if it was an actual buff meh i'd get over it but it was a bad change to begin with, i don't know what class you play but imagine having to activate your final attack every time you log in, it gets especially annoying when you die often for example when practicing for bosses and its just not needed.
  • DiscordOfColorsDiscordOfColors
    Reactions: 965
    Posts: 45
    Member
    edited May 2017
    nexon will not change things to your liking since they are lazy.
    its exactly that mentality that lets them get by with all these bugs and player neglecting, people should speak up and spam the hell out of them or they will just do nothing. because that's easier. so stop defending them and try to change something.

    I'm not going to move this, was more of a question than a suggestion.
    this most certainly wasn't a question. my suggestion is doing something with wind archer's triffling, its the only class with final attack on toggle. with it i have 10 buffs to reapply every time i log in, die, buffs run out, and what not (yes pets make life easy but its not the solution). i don't want to turn this into a rant but it's pretty stupid, especially when comparing to classes like shade which only have 1 buff and that's maple warrior.. (15 minutes between buffing?) without a ton of buff duration as wind archer i would probably spend more time buffing than i would be killing. so yea, in the regard that it lasts forever its nice, but, its not something that needs to be recast every re-log, disconnect or especially deaths.

    edit reason: spell checking