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Nebulite System Revamp

CatoooloooCatooolooo
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edited October 2017 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
I dont anticipate Nexon even bothering to look at this idea or even try to revamp the neb system since they cant even update the crusader codex to match JMS's, but I want to put out a Reasonable Neb revamp that would be the best that we would ever possibly get.

First I think we need to clean up the Useless nebs (rank D) and special ID nebs (Greater, Lesser, Depleted) by removing the D rank nebs entirely and replacing the special ID nebs with only 1 new nebulite the "Black Chaos" nebulite that has the ability to randomly apply a "Greater, Lesser or Depleted" nebulite type stat boost, 1 for each teir, up to A rank and the stat variance can even extend to % stat boosts of all ranks up to A. nexon should also decide if they want to introduce S rank nebs and if not just remove the data for them, It's regional content exclusive data that's not getting used and so they should either embrace it and use it or remove it.

Second, we have to do something about nebulite upgrading, it's really out of place to have the upgrading of nebs revolve around 2 Cash based systems (one is not even being used currently) and one of them forces you to sacrifice nebs. Nebulite fusion needs to be updated to fit the rest of the systems that make you sacrifice for upgrading like spelltrace and starforce, by removing the neb fusion ticket system entirely and replacing it with meso cost for all fusing from C rank to A rank (or S rank) and costs would increase for the highest rank neb being fused. The cash based way to rank up will be the Reinstating of the Alien cube to the Cash shop and with it a revamp to the alien cube to work on equipment with nebs already applied as well as stand alone nebs, it will have better tier up rates than fusion.

Third, We need to fix/ replace our nebulite shop and revamp the nebulite box system. even with the drop boost that happened about a year ago, nebs are still dropping at a too low rate, so to fix this I believe having 5 ~ 6 different ranks of boxes will fix this and make the system much more pleasing to players with the other changes also applied, the 5 ~ 6 rankings being : Common, Uncommon, Rare, Super Rare and Ultra rare (with maybe a 6th box called Mega Rare if they released S rank nebs).

The common Neb box should drop from normal monsters and boss monsters at a much higher rate (like when they were first released) and should give C rank nebs at a 90% rate wile B rank nebs should have a 10% rate, because the most common ones should have the highest rate of giving the rank of lowest value. The uncommon neb box should drop from normal monsters at the rate the current neb boxes drop at and boss monsters should have it at a slightly higher drop rate, the box will give C rank Nebs at 50% and B rank nebs at 50%. Rare boxes will drop from bosses only at a rate that is either the current neb box drop rate or close to it, and will give B rank nebs at 95% and A rank nebs at 5%. Super Rare boxes will only drop from bosses at a rate a bit lower than current neb box drop rate and give B rank at 50% and A rank at 50%. Ultra rare only dropping from the hardest versions of all bosses at the same drop rate and only gives A rank nebs. If they decide to also introduce S rank nebs then Mega Rare neb box would exist and only be given from certain events and would give A rank at 50% and S rank at 50%. The nebulite shop will have the contents replaced with the Common,Uncommon, Rare and Super rare boxes, with the cost being equal to how easy they are to obtain.

Forth, bringing the fusion UI to current standards and improving the rate of rank up via fusion, this might be out of place but I feel the first 3 points are more important than this one. I think making the UI display the rank up rate of the nebulite ,similar to how Starfoce shows the success rates, would be great, It would display the Tier up rate as well as showing the % to keep the highest rank used and % to drop tier or get the lowest rank used and wouldn't also mind if they slightly improved how the fusion UI looks. I also believe fusion rank up rates need to be adjusted and improved, but since you can also fuse low tier with high tier nebs I feel we need a hybrid upgrade system for neb fusion, one where you are rewarded with a higher tier up rate when using nebs of the same rank.

With all these changes together, I believe it would make for a much more fair and better Neb system for everyone, although merchants would be upset because nebulites would be more available to everyone (and merchants are generally greedy youknowwhats)
Nightcrawl3r

Comments

  • PirateIzzyPirateIzzy
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    edited October 2017
    I actually had my own idea for how Nebulites could work. It would have a few elements of yours, as well as a new take on it.

    Basically, I would also remove D rank, and make S rank available, but it would work a lot differently from it does now.
    Instead of placing a Nebulite directly on your weapon, it would require you to place a low rank Nebulite and feed additional types of that Nebulite and rank (for example, B Rank DEX%) onto it, similar to Arcane Symbols or Nodestones. I would also split it into 2 types of Nebulites: Boost Nebulites and Equipment Nebulites. Boost Nebulites would basically be the same as our current system, but with the upgrade system, and Equipment Nebulites would directly affect the stat of the Equipment it is applied to, based on the Nebulite type you choose, like Additional Options.

    In order to feed these Nebulites at higher ranks, you will need to obtain higher ranked Nebulites via fusing, which will now be more accessible through daily quests in NLC (the entire alien storyline will also be revamped, but I'll go into that another time). The fusing will work similar to jewel craft fusing (for SS rings), but will also give you . Nebulites will also be a lot easier to come by, as Nebulite Boxes will now drop a lot more frequently, and be able to stack now. There will also be 2 new Nebulites, the Master Craftsman's Nebulite and the Meister's Nebulite, which will be new additions to Accessory Crafting and bosses. These will allow you to either rank up a Nebulite that isn't Mounted instantly, or obtain a high-ranking Nebulite (B, A for MC, A, S for Meister).

    Final note: Overalls will get double the boost from Nebulites compared to Tops/Bottoms.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2017
    PirateIzzy wrote: »
    I actually had my own idea for how Nebulites could work. It would have a few elements of yours, as well as a new take on it.

    Basically, I would also remove D rank, and make S rank available, but it would work a lot differently from it does now.
    Instead of placing a Nebulite directly on your weapon, it would require you to place a low rank Nebulite and feed additional types of that Nebulite and rank (for example, B Rank DEX%) onto it, similar to Arcane Symbols or Nodestones. I would also split it into 2 types of Nebulites: Boost Nebulites and Equipment Nebulites. Boost Nebulites would basically be the same as our current system, but with the upgrade system, and Equipment Nebulites would directly affect the stat of the Equipment it is applied to, based on the Nebulite type you choose, like Additional Options.

    In order to feed these Nebulites at higher ranks, you will need to obtain higher ranked Nebulites via fusing, which will now be more accessible through daily quests in NLC (the entire alien storyline will also be revamped, but I'll go into that another time). The fusing will work similar to jewel craft fusing (for SS rings), but will also give you . Nebulites will also be a lot easier to come by, as Nebulite Boxes will now drop a lot more frequently, and be able to stack now. There will also be 2 new Nebulites, the Master Craftsman's Nebulite and the Meister's Nebulite, which will be new additions to Accessory Crafting and bosses. These will allow you to either rank up a Nebulite that isn't Mounted instantly, or obtain a high-ranking Nebulite (B, A for MC, A, S for Meister).

    Final note: Overalls will get double the boost from Nebulites compared to Tops/Bottoms.

    I had ideas similar to that (which included a alien story revamp and new areas + boss) but, in the end I just never bothered putting it up here cause Nexon wouldnt remove an avenue for getting money, especially a non KMS one. look at Jett's (or Zen's) link skill.

    this was the best I could see nexon giving us because it required the least effort, didnt remove possible revenue from the system but still made a decent improvement for players overall with the changes.
  • PirateIzzyPirateIzzy
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    edited October 2017
    Catooolooo wrote: »

    I had ideas similar to that (which included a alien story revamp and new areas + boss) but, in the end I just never bothered putting it up here cause Nexon wouldnt remove an avenue for getting money, especially a non KMS one. look at Jett's (or Zen's) link skill.

    this was the best I could see nexon giving us because it required the least effort, didnt remove possible revenue from the system but still made a decent improvement for players overall with the changes.

    I would agree about Jett, but does anyone actually spend money on Jett's link skill nowadays? Is that still an option? I'm not sure.

    But as for the alien idea, I was going to expand on the story, add some new mobs/maps, and revamp the Galacto Drill boss entirely with new attacks/mechanics, 2D skeleton, and new rewards.

    If only Nexon wasn't allergic to ideas, though.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2017
    PirateIzzy wrote: »
    Catooolooo wrote: »

    I had ideas similar to that (which included a alien story revamp and new areas + boss) but, in the end I just never bothered putting it up here cause Nexon wouldnt remove an avenue for getting money, especially a non KMS one. look at Jett's (or Zen's) link skill.

    this was the best I could see nexon giving us because it required the least effort, didnt remove possible revenue from the system but still made a decent improvement for players overall with the changes.

    I would agree about Jett, but does anyone actually spend money on Jett's link skill nowadays? Is that still an option? I'm not sure.

    But as for the alien idea, I was going to expand on the story, add some new mobs/maps, and revamp the Galacto Drill boss entirely with new attacks/mechanics, 2D skeleton, and new rewards.

    If only Nexon wasn't allergic to ideas, though.

    the stardust shifter and w/e is still sold in the CS, no idea if people still buy them but it's still a lazy money grab that probably wouldnt exist if the korean dev team were going to release the class for KMS.
  • ZephyrusSpringZephyrusSpring
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    edited October 2017
    Why remove D and add S when you could just buff all current nebs? It's basically the same thing without causing the plethora of issues that come with the former. Here's what they need to do:
    • Generally increase the drop rate of nebulite boxes. It should be roughly equivalent to the equipment drop rate in Temple of Time and for bosses it should scale with difficulty.
    • Remove worthless nebs. Either randomly convert them to another neb or at least make them no longer obtainable. This includes the flat +stat nebs. Even without any equipment, a +4 stat neb can't compete with a 1% stat neb. Buffing them instead is an option but I urge caution. They may shift the balance of the game and I recommend making them unaffected by other potentials.
    • Consolidate the stats into a single tier per rank. One A neb giving 3% dex and another giving 4% is pretty unfair. The chance of ranking up a neb and fusing for the specific stat you want is already low. This should also involve shifting the %stat nebs down one rank so that D has 1% stat going up to A with 4% stat.
    • Remove the fusion ticket requirements and replace it with a meso cost. (Nexon if you want to take the easy way out you could put fusion tickets in general stores.)
    • Fusing a neb with another which is one tier lower should guarantee a neb of the higher rank. E.g. fusing a C with a B should guarantee a B.
    • Remove the nebulite diffuser. Putting a new nebulite on a piece of equipment that already has one should simply replace and destroy the installed neb.

    As for keeping the money flowing, I agree that the alien cubes should see a return and should work on equipment with nebulites as well as stand alone nebs. They could also introduce a cash shop nebulite box which gives B rank nebs with a chance of A, which combined with point 5 would be very beneficial to the economy.

    Adding scaling tiers of neb boxes is an interesting idea but I'm not sure I'm 100% on board. If the regular box drop rate is decent then nebulite supply shouldn't be an issue. Something like that should be left for later until we can see what effect the other changes have had.

    How to work it into the crafting system is another topic that needs more discussion and ideas. I believe there should be 3 tiers of crafted neb items. One requires level 10 crafting, another craftsmen, and the last meister. These items would work in essentially the same way as the alien cube would, except that they could only be used on unequiped nebs, and only on matching or lower ranked nebs. Those ranks being D, C and B respectively. These items would have a higher chance of ranking up a neb than fusing but lower than using the alien cube. They could also be consumed to reward a random neb of their respective rank. They should stay unique to the crafting system (no dropping from bosses) and be fully tradable. What these neb items would be crafted out of, I have no idea, nor what they would be called.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2017
    remove D rank nebs because they are garbage to the point that buffing them wouldnt help and consist mostly of useless nebs like "% chance to make x face when getting hit", not really sure what issues would be caused with their removal as nexon can just replace them with C rank nebs for ones already applied to equipment (if there are any), there is precedent of this with how they removed and replaced pot lines like avoid and accuracy and also replaced nebs with avoid and accuracy with the greater, lesser and depleted nebs.
  • ZephyrusSpringZephyrusSpring
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    edited October 2017
    There's also the people who have As on everything which will suddenly not be the best any more, and given the nature of nebs they'll have to essentially scrap everything they already have in order to use S nebs. Again, I don't see how removing D and adding S will achieve something that buffing D-A won't. I agree that the garbage needs to get taken out, the same goes for all ranks of nebs. The strategy wiki is a little out of date (unless nebs are what's out of date) but you can see all the possible stats you can get at each rank. If the wiki is to be believed there are actually a lot more useless nebs in higher ranks, for example: 3% chance to get 20 mp when attacking. Removing D nebs will solve nothing.

    What I'm proposing is to replace everything that gives a flat amount of stats (+dex, +defense, +attack, etc) with a % increase scaling from 1% at D rank to 4% at A rank. Massively simplify what nebs are available.
  • PirateIzzyPirateIzzy
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    edited October 2017
    There's also the people who have As on everything which will suddenly not be the best any more, and given the nature of nebs they'll have to essentially scrap everything they already have in order to use S nebs. Again, I don't see how removing D and adding S will achieve something that buffing D-A won't. I agree that the garbage needs to get taken out, the same goes for all ranks of nebs. The strategy wiki is a little out of date (unless nebs are what's out of date) but you can see all the possible stats you can get at each rank. If the wiki is to be believed there are actually a lot more useless nebs in higher ranks, for example: 3% chance to get 20 mp when attacking. Removing D nebs will solve nothing.

    What I'm proposing is to replace everything that gives a flat amount of stats (+dex, +defense, +attack, etc) with a % increase scaling from 1% at D rank to 4% at A rank. Massively simplify what nebs are available.

    That's why I suggested a rank-up system similar to Arcane Symbols: so that people can upgrade their equipped Nebulites.
  • MrCardsMrCards
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    edited October 2017
    ill, much rather them just replacing the neb system, with flames, gms don't know how to revamp stuff properly. they will just probably Butcher the "Revamped" Nebulites to an even greater extent then it already is. like making it even more unobtainable, or broken, or pay for win. flames owns nebs.
  • NyaraNyara
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    edited October 2017
    MrCards wrote: »
    ill, much rather them just replacing the neb system, with flames, gms don't know how to revamp stuff properly. they will just probably Butcher the "Revamped" Nebulites to an even greater extent then it already is. like making it even more unobtainable, or broken, or pay for win. flames owns nebs.

    As for the transition Nebulite to Flame I suggest to just put a NPC that allows you to exchange your nebulites for coins (more for each rank), and also an item to remove the nebulites from equips without destroying them. With those coins you can buy flames at a special event shop. After a given date all nebulites from equips or standalone will be removed altogether and all players will be gifted some flames as an apology for inconvences. That is all.

    The most funny thing is that flames are already coded in GMS, in fact we have flamed gear in Luna since they had flames in the past, so all you have to do is to stop removing flames from specific shops/events, which is actually easier labor wise. So the only trouble is making the shop, the NPC (which can be Maple Admin with just a few added options temporally like the dozen of times they have done that before) and the item to remove nebulites from equips (and they can even put it at the same event shop with a high meso price and add a cash shop version to pay for the coding, if they feel like).
    MrCards
  • PhantomMasterThiefPhantomMasterThief
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    edited October 2017
    Nyara wrote: »
    MrCards wrote: »
    ill, much rather them just replacing the neb system, with flames, gms don't know how to revamp stuff properly. they will just probably Butcher the "Revamped" Nebulites to an even greater extent then it already is. like making it even more unobtainable, or broken, or pay for win. flames owns nebs.

    As for the transition Nebulite to Flame I suggest to just put a NPC that allows you to exchange your nebulites for coins (more for each rank), and also an item to remove the nebulites from equips without destroying them. With those coins you can buy flames at a special event shop. After a given date all nebulites from equips or standalone will be removed altogether and all players will be gifted some flames as an apology for inconvences. That is all.

    The most funny thing is that flames are already coded in GMS, in fact we have flamed gear in Luna since they had flames in the past, so all you have to do is to stop removing flames from specific shops/events, which is actually easier labor wise. So the only trouble is making the shop, the NPC (which can be Maple Admin with just a few added options temporally like the dozen of times they have done that before) and the item to remove nebulites from equips (and they can even put it at the same event shop with a high meso price and add a cash shop version to pay for the coding, if they feel like).

    I would L O V E this. just without the cash shop option please. keep flames F2P.

    also then people won't complain about nebulites removal, nice idea.
  • NyaraNyara
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    edited October 2017
    I would L O V E this. just without the cash shop option please. keep flames F2P.

    also then people won't complain about nebulites removal, nice idea.

    Oh, I just meant the item to remove nebulites from equips, since nebulites already have P2W on them so I don't see why not as long as a meso option is available.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2017
    this is a suggestion for a change to the system already implemented in GMS, they have already said like 2 ~ 3 times now that they do not plan to bring flames to GMS, campaign for it in the Flames thread.

    this is a thread for trying to improve the already implemented system of nebulites, not to replace it with a system GMS do not seem to want. It's an alternative for them not wanting flames in GMS, so take all those grand suggestions of neb removal/replacement to the Flames thread. This is a thread for discussion of improving the already implemented system of nebulites.