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Phantom has a problem with cardinal burst.

KassunukkoKassunukko
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edited June 2020 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
I'm now a level 225 Phantom main in Luna, and I have discovered a problem with Phantoms and Pathfinders. First problem is that Phantom can steal a total of 5 skills from Pathfinders and out of that 5 skills 3 of them are buffs. Well that is not that big of a problem, because the bigger problem is that if you were to equip "Cardinal burst" on Phantom to the 4th job Impeccable memory slot you still get the same Pathfinders 2nd job Cardinal burst and it's nothing compared to the Pathfinders maxed 4th job Cardinal burst with bigger vfx and more damage% scaling. So my idea is that when a Phantom equips "Cardinal burst" into lets say 3rd job Impeccable memory, then the Phantom would get the equivalent damage% and vfx on the Cardinal burst that a Pathfinder, that has maxed the passives that buff Cardinal burst, would have at 3rd job. (Pictures make it easier to understand.)

normal_2nd_job_cardinal_burst.png

3rd_job_cardinal_burst.png

4th_job_cardinal_burst.png

Thanks for your time.
  1. Would this be a good idea?7 votes
    1. Yes
       14% (1 vote)
    2. No
       86% (6 votes)

Comments

  • AaronHuskyAaronHusky
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    edited June 2020
    Phantom only having access to the 2nd job version of cardinal burst is intentional. Pathfinder has theirs upgraded from passives in their 3rd and 4th jobs.

    I think it's better if burst stays as the 2nd job version personally. Phantom having access to upgraded versions would be somewhat overpowered. Plus Phantom can steal cannon bazooka, showdown, or eight legs easton for 4th job mobbing.
  • KassunukkoKassunukko
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    edited June 2020
    It would still help the fact that Phantoms can steal only 2 attacking skills from Pathfinders which is nowhere near the amount of abilities Phantoms can steal from other explorers. And I'd say that yes it would be a nice buff, but it is what Phantom needs to be a viable pick in my own opinion. (It would be nice if cardinal burst scaled a bit better in the late game with a bit more damage%)
  • AaronHuskyAaronHusky
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    edited June 2020
    Phantom is already viable without getting access to upgraded cardinal burst. They have access to better mobbing skills from other explorers in 4th job.

    If you really want to keep using cardinal burst, you could invest in an impeccable memory ii node, but I think it's better to use a different skill instead.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited June 2020
    Cardinal burst is upgraded by a passive. You, as a phantom, lack this passive, so you lack the upgrade. You get the skill as it appears in pathfinder's second job.

    And the amount of attacking skills you can steal per class has absolutely no bearing on anything.
  • KassunukkoKassunukko
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    edited June 2020
    But still. Phantoms get only 2 good skills from Pathfinders. Doesn't that seem a bit dumb?
  • AaronHuskyAaronHusky
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    edited June 2020
    Not really. Pathfinder's pretty unique for an explorer. Plus you have 14 other classes to borrow skills from.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited June 2020
    Kassunukko wrote: »
    But still. Phantoms get only 2 good skills from Pathfinders. Doesn't that seem a bit dumb?

    No. It's completely arbitrary. What's dumb is the people who cried for years that "we need" a third explorer archer solely because the other four branches had three.
  • KassunukkoKassunukko
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    edited June 2020
    That is true. But I just wanted a skills that would scale a bit better for me at least. I wouldn't say it would break the whole game but it could be a bit op for the late game Phantoms.
  • LatemasterLatemaster
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    edited June 2020
    Well since phantoms can steal tons of skills they are supposed to be little bit nerfed versions (like no hyper skill boosts or passive skill boosts or cooldown reduction). I guess most classes don't have any decent skills to steal and some have more than one. And with all the stolen buffs phantom is more of a support than dmg dealer anyways.
    darik
  • darikdarik
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    edited June 2020
    Kassunukko wrote: »
    That is true. But I just wanted a skills that would scale a bit better for me at least. I wouldn't say it would break the whole game but it could be a bit op for the late game Phantoms.

    i agree, phanntoms are kind of weak atm, seems like nexon is scared to buff it in case they make it broken? idk
  • woelewoele
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    edited June 2020
    I main a Phantom but it sucks :)
  • estalcil134estalcil134
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    edited August 2020
    darik wrote: »
    Kassunukko wrote: »
    That is true. But I just wanted a skills that would scale a bit better for me at least. I wouldn't say it would break the whole game but it could be a bit op for the late game Phantoms.

    i agree, phanntoms are kind of weak atm, seems like nexon is scared to buff it in case they make it broken? idk

    I do think phantoms need a little buff, and some QoL changes (as a phantom main).

    First is the availability of skills. A system could easily be implemented: allow skills to be stolen from the job instructors in El Nath and Leafre (in fact, this system was already implemented in maplestory m)
    This allows for a bit more flexibility during gameplay, as not every class is available to steal from *coughfirepoisonmagecough*

    Second is a slight buff to phantom's main skills (mille aiguilles is the first to come to mind). Although it's a hurricane skill, the dmg% on that is horrendous. That being said, it's still a hurricane skill, so I think a slight boost (110% to ~125-130%) is sufficient.

    Third is more skill availability. Yes, we can get a wide range of skills already with the system, but since its birth, it's only been nerfed. I'd like to see more skills we can steal and use (such as shadow partner). The current phantom skill meta is pretty much all the same, so hopefully more skills might be able to change it. (aka im hoping shadow partner can replace cross surge, even if the lines from shadow partner don't proc carte blanc).
    Also, I wanna be able to steal from Cygnus knights, they've been around long enough and are also a kinda general class like explorers...

    TL;DR more skill availability and slight buff to main skills is needed to make phantom more viable and a more fun class to play.
  • iArrowZiArrowZ
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    edited August 2020
    are your nodes maxed? cus that is a huge boost to the "phantom" skills that you are looking for an increase in power.
  • estalcil134estalcil134
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    edited August 2020
    iArrowZ wrote: »
    are your nodes maxed? cus that is a huge boost to the "phantom" skills that you are looking for an increase in power.

    even if your nodes are maxed, it still stands that phantom, a supposed "burst class" is still outdamaged by most other classes, especially when you change your skills to be more versatile in bossing.
    in the end, phantoms don't have enough dmg in bossing to be useful, and phantoms don't have enough support in bossing to be useful
    we're in this terrible in-between, and yet nexon can't really buff us because not enough people play it to know how the class is really supposed to play
    i've seen a lot of arguments where most of the opposing side are people who have never touched phantoms in their life, or have played phantom only to pre-200, which is highly insufficient to properly notice the class's shortcomings
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited August 2020
    estalcil134 wrote: »
    iArrowZ wrote: »
    are your nodes maxed? cus that is a huge boost to the "phantom" skills that you are looking for an increase in power.

    even if your nodes are maxed, it still stands that phantom, a supposed "burst class" is still outdamaged by most other classes, especially when you change your skills to be more versatile in bossing.
    in the end, phantoms don't have enough dmg in bossing to be useful, and phantoms don't have enough support in bossing to be useful
    we're in this terrible in-between, and yet nexon can't really buff us because not enough people play it to know how the class is really supposed to play
    i've seen a lot of arguments where most of the opposing side are people who have never touched phantoms in their life, or have played phantom only to pre-200, which is highly insufficient to properly notice the class's shortcomings

    J62H3jK.png

    There are phantoms in black mage parties what in the crap are you talking about "phantoms aren't useful enough in bossing"?