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Suggestion: remove this category as a forum

Violent2Violent2
Reactions: 225
Posts: 11
Member
edited October 2020 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
Pretty much title says it all. And you should not supply this forum as an alternative to rejected ticket submissions as nobody with the discretion to make changes considers the ideas presented in this forum. It is almost embarrassing, the forum is very inactive to begin with and virtually nothing worth considering has been looked at.

Seriously,
- Transparent androids
- psok for equipped nx
- saved nodestone settings, saved key settings
- Addressing the spawn rate problem
just to name a few.. Your community is already small as is, surprising you guys are ambitious enough to blatantly ignore them on a regular basis.
PirateIzzyTurtlesRock

Comments

  • AggraphineAggraphine
    Reactions: 19,375
    Posts: 3,553
    Member
    edited October 2020
    The problem is that the nexon we know is little more than a publisher. They have no development capabilities. In fact, I don't think any region does; it's all done by the main Korean office with various overseas teams. So it's understandable that a lot of "good" suggestions are effectively shouted at the void.
    YinYangX
  • PirateIzzyPirateIzzy
    Reactions: 4,620
    Posts: 689
    Member
    edited October 2020
    I 100% agree with you, OP. This section of the forums merely exists to give the impression that Nexon cares, when they really don't.
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    The problem is that the nexon we know is little more than a publisher. They have no development capabilities. In fact, I don't think any region does; it's all done by the main Korean office with various overseas teams. So it's understandable that a lot of "good" suggestions are effectively shouted at the void.

    That only reinforces the idea that this section of the forums is useless, and serves even less purpose than a Change.org petition in terms of making a difference towards anything.
    Violent2darik
  • ADeliColdCutADeliColdCut
    Reactions: 520
    Posts: 9
    Member
    edited October 2020
    Violent2 wrote: »
    Pretty much title says it all. And you should not supply this forum as an alternative to rejected ticket submissions as nobody with the discretion to make changes considers the ideas presented in this forum. It is almost embarrassing, the forum is very inactive to begin with and virtually nothing worth considering has been looked at.

    Seriously,
    - Transparent androids
    - psok for equipped nx
    - saved nodestone settings, saved key settings
    - Addressing the spawn rate problem
    just to name a few.. Your community is already small as is, surprising you guys are ambitious enough to blatantly ignore them on a regular basis.

    Hello Violent2:

    I must admit, when I first read the title of your thread my mind already trended towards this being a nonsensical posting. However, I must admit my initial suspicions were not accurate as the point you raise is one I also pondered...

    To your point raised
    I realize I have far less history and investment into these forums as others, and therefore I am cautious to discredit the value of that work by the community and the mods. But when I submitted a ticket along with a potential suggestion to correct it, it was disconcerting to me that the boilerplate responses received were that I should bring my suggestion to the forum. It certainly leaves on with the feel that you have just "shouted at the void," to quote Aggraphine.

    If I may tack on a tangential suggestion to your suggestion...
    While I'm still in the infancy stage with the forums, I think that it would go a long way if we were to see a list of the suggestions that originated from this forum and have actually been implemented into the game as a result of it coming from this forum.

    I think it would be a nice public relations project and showing if they provided a thread in which the mods could update with a running list of the ideas from the forum that were considered and implemented into the game. Being honest, even if the list was fabricated or was populated with ideas that were already slated for introduction to the game, the community's perception of having a more active involvement in the direction the game is actually something that carries great value, even if only a perception.

    Is there a chance (Of high or low magnitude) that this list would have zero entries? Sure, it is possible.

    The idea is not to have a list of implemented features, but a very specific list of implemented features that originated from a forum posting by a community non-affiliated player member. At the very least, we can see some evidence that the efforts of people here are not going to waste.

    (I do not wish to highjack your thread, but it was your thread that made me consider this idea)
    Violent2
  • Violent2Violent2
    Reactions: 225
    Posts: 11
    Member
    edited October 2020
    Violent2 wrote: »
    Pretty much title says it all. And you should not supply this forum as an alternative to rejected ticket submissions as nobody with the discretion to make changes considers the ideas presented in this forum. It is almost embarrassing, the forum is very inactive to begin with and virtually nothing worth considering has been looked at.

    Seriously,
    - Transparent androids
    - psok for equipped nx
    - saved nodestone settings, saved key settings
    - Addressing the spawn rate problem
    just to name a few.. Your community is already small as is, surprising you guys are ambitious enough to blatantly ignore them on a regular basis.

    Hello Violent2:

    I must admit, when I first read the title of your thread my mind already trended towards this being a nonsensical posting. However, I must admit my initial suspicions were not accurate as the point you raise is one I also pondered...

    To your point raised
    I realize I have far less history and investment into these forums as others, and therefore I am cautious to discredit the value of that work by the community and the mods. But when I submitted a ticket along with a potential suggestion to correct it, it was disconcerting to me that the boilerplate responses received were that I should bring my suggestion to the forum. It certainly leaves on with the feel that you have just "shouted at the void," to quote Aggraphine.

    If I may tack on a tangential suggestion to your suggestion...
    While I'm still in the infancy stage with the forums, I think that it would go a long way if we were to see a list of the suggestions that originated from this forum and have actually been implemented into the game as a result of it coming from this forum.

    I think it would be a nice public relations project and showing if they provided a thread in which the mods could update with a running list of the ideas from the forum that were considered and implemented into the game. Being honest, even if the list was fabricated or was populated with ideas that were already slated for introduction to the game, the community's perception of having a more active involvement in the direction the game is actually something that carries great value, even if only a perception.

    Is there a chance (Of high or low magnitude) that this list would have zero entries? Sure, it is possible.

    The idea is not to have a list of implemented features, but a very specific list of implemented features that originated from a forum posting by a community non-affiliated player member. At the very least, we can see some evidence that the efforts of people here are not going to waste.

    (I do not wish to highjack your thread, but it was your thread that made me consider this idea)

    I think that is the sad part, the community seems to be very passionate, but there is little evidence this forum is anything more than a second 'raves and rants' forum with a different format.

    I think it could be a decent idea for them to point out what they have done from these threads. As like you mentioned, for PR, as well as to allow other players to asses whether it is worth it for them to make their own thread if they have a suggestion.
  • AKradianAKradian
    Reactions: 39,230
    Posts: 5,976
    Volunteer Forum Moderator, Private Tester
    edited October 2020
    Oddly enough, your very first example - transparent androids - was implemented.
    Not exactly as we might have envisioned it, since Nexon chose to bundle android transparency with skill and pet transparency (and familiars in GMS), but still, we got a way to make our androids invisible.

    Another suggestion that has been made here time and again, recently came to pass: Zero in Reboot.
    Was it implemented because we (GMS players) asked for it?
    Was it implemented because KMS players asked for it?
    Was it implemented because it had been sitting on Nexon's to-do list since Reboot's inception, and its time has finally come?
    We don't know. We're never told.

    We do know that the "Effect" button in our Equipment UI was implemented because GMS players were asking for a way to hide the Sengoku ghosts that accompanied the then-BiS Sengoku Totems. We know it came as a result of our request, because no other service has this feature of turning off equipment effects.

    The Community team (VFMs and CMs) collects the feedback and suggestions from these forums, and forwards them to the decision makers at Nexon.
    Nothing happens immediately, because Nexon doesn't work that fast. Even when they choose to do stuff, it goes on a priority queue along with whatever else they have planned, and might only show up months or even years later, and sometimes (like the transparent androids) not quite the way the original suggestion wanted it. And maybe they decide not to do anything with that suggestion or feedback, but still it sits in the backs of their minds and might affect future decisions in a positive way.

    You're right that very few suggestions get implemented at all. But "you can't win if you don't play". Do keep offering your feedback and making your suggestions. In the long term, they help make the game better for us all.
  • TurtlesRockTurtlesRock
    Reactions: 1,290
    Posts: 72
    Member
    edited October 2020
    AKradian wrote: »
    Oddly enough, your very first example - transparent androids - was implemented.
    Not exactly as we might have envisioned it, since Nexon chose to bundle android transparency with skill and pet transparency (and familiars in GMS), but still, we got a way to make our androids invisible.

    Another suggestion that has been made here time and again, recently came to pass: Zero in Reboot.
    Was it implemented because we (GMS players) asked for it?
    Was it implemented because KMS players asked for it?
    Was it implemented because it had been sitting on Nexon's to-do list since Reboot's inception, and its time has finally come?
    We don't know. We're never told.

    We do know that the "Effect" button in our Equipment UI was implemented because GMS players were asking for a way to hide the Sengoku ghosts that accompanied the then-BiS Sengoku Totems. We know it came as a result of our request, because no other service has this feature of turning off equipment effects.

    So, Nexon will tackle small and easily fixable issues, but will steer clear of the big problems that everyone complains about? Transparent androids? Hide sengoku ghosts? And zero in reboot? What about potable badges, spawn/meso rate, hackers, dark totems, and cluttered maps?

    Edit: By the way, Nexon really sucks at fixing the small issues too.
  • AKradianAKradian
    Reactions: 39,230
    Posts: 5,976
    Volunteer Forum Moderator, Private Tester
    edited October 2020
    So, Nexon will tackle small and easily fixable issues, but will steer clear of the big problems that everyone complains about? Transparent androids? Hide sengoku ghosts? And zero in reboot? What about potable badges, spawn/meso rate, hackers, dark totems, and cluttered maps?

    Zero in Reboot is not a "small and easily fixable issue", or it wouldn't have taken five years to happen.

    As for the "big problems that everyone complains about", the thing with those is that the player desires conflict with Nexon's vision for the game.
    This section of the forums is for players to offer feedback and suggestions, not to issue orders. Nexon is the developer and, after reading and weighing player feedback, they can ultimately do whatever they wish with the game. The players, on the other hand, have the freedom to decide whether to keep playing (and paying) despite unfavorable changes (or lack of favorable changes), or not.
    Badges with potential are a classic case of this. Nexon is fully aware that GMS players are not happy about those no longer being available. And they knew it even before they removed Singapore. But they made the decision because they thought it was essential for game balance, or something. And players are still playing, and even jumping on the hype train for new classes (first Pathfinder, then Adele) that will never have a badge with potential.

    Regarding spawn/meso rate, Nexon is constantly tackling that, though maybe not in the ways you like. They are repeatedly tweaking Kishin, and have added Fury/Wild totems. In KMS, they've been increasing spawn count in certain maps, patch after patch. They are aware there is a problem, and are trying to solve it, but they don't want to give us what most players seem to want because they're afraid it will make progression too fast, enabling too many players to "finish the game" and quit.

    Hackers have been dealt with, pretty effectively, at least for now.

    I don't know what the story is with Dark Lords of Darkness. They tried to skip it in 2018, saying "we had too many other new events for Halloween so there was no room for it". Players protested loudly (on these forums, as well as reddit and Discord), and Nexon heeded the feedback (yes, it happens!) and brought the event back in February of 2019, in addition to running it normally for Halloween 2019. This year's Halloween patch doesn't seem overloaded, so that excuse for skipping Dark Lords of Darkness again doesn't hold. I strongly encourage players to protest again. Hopefully the protest will be effective again.

    For cluttered maps, the KMS spawn increases in less-popular maps are intended to deal with it. KMS worlds are considerably more crowded than ours, so you can be sure Nexon is hearing complaints about the best maps being highly contested from many sources. Unfortunately, as long as the game isn't all identical maps, there will always be a "best spot" and there will never be enough instances of it for everyone. At least, not at a cost that's worth it to the publisher.

    Anyway, back to the point of the thread: This section of the forums is not useless. Don't expect anything you say to be implemented in the game, immediately or at all. But also don't give up on saying what you think. It does have an effect.
  • Violent2Violent2
    Reactions: 225
    Posts: 11
    Member
    edited October 2020
    AKradian wrote: »
    Oddly enough, your very first example - transparent androids - was implemented.
    Not exactly as we might have envisioned it, since Nexon chose to bundle android transparency with skill and pet transparency (and familiars in GMS), but still, we got a way to make our androids invisible.

    Another suggestion that has been made here time and again, recently came to pass: Zero in Reboot.
    Was it implemented because we (GMS players) asked for it?
    Was it implemented because KMS players asked for it?
    Was it implemented because it had been sitting on Nexon's to-do list since Reboot's inception, and its time has finally come?
    We don't know. We're never told.

    We do know that the "Effect" button in our Equipment UI was implemented because GMS players were asking for a way to hide the Sengoku ghosts that accompanied the then-BiS Sengoku Totems. We know it came as a result of our request, because no other service has this feature of turning off equipment effects.

    The Community team (VFMs and CMs) collects the feedback and suggestions from these forums, and forwards them to the decision makers at Nexon.
    Nothing happens immediately, because Nexon doesn't work that fast. Even when they choose to do stuff, it goes on a priority queue along with whatever else they have planned, and might only show up months or even years later, and sometimes (like the transparent androids) not quite the way the original suggestion wanted it. And maybe they decide not to do anything with that suggestion or feedback, but still it sits in the backs of their minds and might affect future decisions in a positive way.

    You're right that very few suggestions get implemented at all. But "you can't win if you don't play". Do keep offering your feedback and making your suggestions. In the long term, they help make the game better for us all.


    It is obvious this forum is simply a cop-out for tickets they don't want to address. and hey, that's ok, because they can wrap up the bad-news email by providing one last alternative, 'just go rant to other players about it'.

    And what an interesting situation, so the biases of VFM's and CM's are used as curation to show to decision makers of Nexon'? I just saw you in another thread shut down a suggestion for allowing cut scenes to be skippable (a common complaint) in some of the rudest behaviour I've seen on this forum. Patronizing and sarcastic responses to valid suggestions shouldn't be the standard for the VFM's bringing our suggestions to Nexon (i.e. this one by you the other day): I like stories.
    But I hate boss fights.
    So I think Nexon should add a "skip" button to boss fights and just give me the rewards without me having to go through the unpleasant part.
    What do you say?

    So maybe the process for how these suggestions get to Nexon's decision makers is something worth reassessing. Not sure exactly what the problem is, but the amount of ideas that are largely supported by the player base, yet neglected by Nexon far outweighs the minimal gains you are highlighting here. I understand this isn't a forum to make orders, but the developer neglect is undeniable.
  • darikdarik
    Reactions: 2,995
    Posts: 586
    Member
    edited October 2020
    i have used this forum for years and its always been useful to have it, i like to think that nexon reads our suggestions every now and then and try to implement some, also, we, the community , have a place to discuss different suggestions and possible solutions to existing problems of the game so that the maple experience improves.

    Deleting this forum is like rejecting all chances we have to suggest stuff. People that usually frequent this forums really love maplestory, we argue and we complain because we love the game and we want it to be better , so that we have a better time playing this game.

    I dont know how to explain it, but deleting this forum is like giving up on the game, which i dont want to.

  • Instinct9001Instinct9001
    Reactions: 545
    Posts: 21
    Member
    edited October 2020
    AKradian wrote: »
    So, Nexon will tackle small and easily fixable issues, but will steer clear of the big problems that everyone complains about? Transparent androids? Hide sengoku ghosts? And zero in reboot? What about potable badges, spawn/meso rate, hackers, dark totems, and cluttered maps?

    Zero in Reboot is not a "small and easily fixable issue", or it wouldn't have taken five years to happen.

    As for the "big problems that everyone complains about", the thing with those is that the player desires conflict with Nexon's vision for the game.
    This section of the forums is for players to offer feedback and suggestions, not to issue orders. Nexon is the developer and, after reading and weighing player feedback, they can ultimately do whatever they wish with the game. The players, on the other hand, have the freedom to decide whether to keep playing (and paying) despite unfavorable changes (or lack of favorable changes), or not.
    Badges with potential are a classic case of this. Nexon is fully aware that GMS players are not happy about those no longer being available. And they knew it even before they removed Singapore. But they made the decision because they thought it was essential for game balance, or something. And players are still playing, and even jumping on the hype train for new classes (first Pathfinder, then Adele) that will never have a badge with potential.

    Regarding spawn/meso rate, Nexon is constantly tackling that, though maybe not in the ways you like. They are repeatedly tweaking Kishin, and have added Fury/Wild totems. In KMS, they've been increasing spawn count in certain maps, patch after patch. They are aware there is a problem, and are trying to solve it, but they don't want to give us what most players seem to want because they're afraid it will make progression too fast, enabling too many players to "finish the game" and quit.

    Hackers have been dealt with, pretty effectively, at least for now.

    I don't know what the story is with Dark Lords of Darkness. They tried to skip it in 2018, saying "we had too many other new events for Halloween so there was no room for it". Players protested loudly (on these forums, as well as reddit and Discord), and Nexon heeded the feedback (yes, it happens!) and brought the event back in February of 2019, in addition to running it normally for Halloween 2019. This year's Halloween patch doesn't seem overloaded, so that excuse for skipping Dark Lords of Darkness again doesn't hold. I strongly encourage players to protest again. Hopefully the protest will be effective again.

    For cluttered maps, the KMS spawn increases in less-popular maps are intended to deal with it. KMS worlds are considerably more crowded than ours, so you can be sure Nexon is hearing complaints about the best maps being highly contested from many sources. Unfortunately, as long as the game isn't all identical maps, there will always be a "best spot" and there will never be enough instances of it for everyone. At least, not at a cost that's worth it to the publisher.

    Anyway, back to the point of the thread: This section of the forums is not useless. Don't expect anything you say to be implemented in the game, immediately or at all. But also don't give up on saying what you think. It does have an effect.

    LOL Addressing the spawn/meso rate? Come on! Fury/wild totem is a utter joke compared to Frenzy, and same goes for kishin.. I think by 'addressing the spawn rate', the people want an option where they don't have to buy an item for > $10,000 USD on the black market to make the mob-hunting part of the game bearable. Seriously, if you are level 240+ using a wild totem, people are laughing at you. Alternatively, buying frenzy service means the leveling aspect of the game is contingent on someone with Frenzy totem being online and willing to sell it as a service. How has this been going on for so many years? They've made many tweaks to kishin and fury totem (as you mentioned) yet this is still what is happening in actuality.

    *Also* It taking 5 years to implement Zero into Reboot isn't an indication of how hard it is for them to do these things... That timeline for that feature inclusion doesn't seem right.
    darik
  • darikdarik
    Reactions: 2,995
    Posts: 586
    Member
    edited October 2020
    AKradian wrote: »
    So, Nexon will tackle small and easily fixable issues, but will steer clear of the big problems that everyone complains about? Transparent androids? Hide sengoku ghosts? And zero in reboot? What about potable badges, spawn/meso rate, hackers, dark totems, and cluttered maps?

    Zero in Reboot is not a "small and easily fixable issue", or it wouldn't have taken five years to happen.

    As for the "big problems that everyone complains about", the thing with those is that the player desires conflict with Nexon's vision for the game.
    This section of the forums is for players to offer feedback and suggestions, not to issue orders. Nexon is the developer and, after reading and weighing player feedback, they can ultimately do whatever they wish with the game. The players, on the other hand, have the freedom to decide whether to keep playing (and paying) despite unfavorable changes (or lack of favorable changes), or not.
    Badges with potential are a classic case of this. Nexon is fully aware that GMS players are not happy about those no longer being available. And they knew it even before they removed Singapore. But they made the decision because they thought it was essential for game balance, or something. And players are still playing, and even jumping on the hype train for new classes (first Pathfinder, then Adele) that will never have a badge with potential.

    Regarding spawn/meso rate, Nexon is constantly tackling that, though maybe not in the ways you like. They are repeatedly tweaking Kishin, and have added Fury/Wild totems. In KMS, they've been increasing spawn count in certain maps, patch after patch. They are aware there is a problem, and are trying to solve it, but they don't want to give us what most players seem to want because they're afraid it will make progression too fast, enabling too many players to "finish the game" and quit.

    Hackers have been dealt with, pretty effectively, at least for now.

    I don't know what the story is with Dark Lords of Darkness. They tried to skip it in 2018, saying "we had too many other new events for Halloween so there was no room for it". Players protested loudly (on these forums, as well as reddit and Discord), and Nexon heeded the feedback (yes, it happens!) and brought the event back in February of 2019, in addition to running it normally for Halloween 2019. This year's Halloween patch doesn't seem overloaded, so that excuse for skipping Dark Lords of Darkness again doesn't hold. I strongly encourage players to protest again. Hopefully the protest will be effective again.

    For cluttered maps, the KMS spawn increases in less-popular maps are intended to deal with it. KMS worlds are considerably more crowded than ours, so you can be sure Nexon is hearing complaints about the best maps being highly contested from many sources. Unfortunately, as long as the game isn't all identical maps, there will always be a "best spot" and there will never be enough instances of it for everyone. At least, not at a cost that's worth it to the publisher.

    Anyway, back to the point of the thread: This section of the forums is not useless. Don't expect anything you say to be implemented in the game, immediately or at all. But also don't give up on saying what you think. It does have an effect.

    LOL Addressing the spawn/meso rate? Come on! Fury/wild totem is a utter joke compared to Frenzy, and same goes for kishin.. I think by 'addressing the spawn rate', the people want an option where they don't have to buy an item for > $10,000 USD on the black market to make the mob-hunting part of the game bearable. Seriously, if you are level 240+ using a wild totem, people are laughing at you. Alternatively, buying frenzy service means the leveling aspect of the game is contingent on someone with Frenzy totem being online and willing to sell it as a service. How has this been going on for so many years? They've made many tweaks to kishin and fury totem (as you mentioned) yet this is still what is happening in actuality.

    *Also* It taking 5 years to implement Zero into Reboot isn't an indication of how hard it is for them to do these things... That timeline for that feature inclusion doesn't seem right.

    Sadly idk what are they doing with the kishin and wild totem issue. They nerfed kishin for no reason at all by adding it a cooldown, which benefited NO ONE and damaged everyone, both kanna mains, farmers and ppl that used a 2nd pc to kishin yourself. Ive talked this issue with people that dont play this game and the fact that you need a certain class to make this game bearable is such a stupid design.
    Its very easy to just implement kishin as a link skill, add kishin node, lower the wild totem prize to 100 or 200 reward points, or even selling it for mesos, increasing general spawn rate, reverting kishin cd to what it was before , etc etc, so many things can be done to make farming and training bearable yet they arent introducing ANY of them, why? i dont know, but id love to know why.
    !,8k reward points for a single wild totem is so stupid, does nexon know how long it takes to gather that much? And once u get it, u are oblied to play for 2 hrs straight , whyh not make it 24 hrs, or just make the time count when the totem is casted? Why not increase the duration to 4 or 6 or 8 hours? And the list goes on and on.

    Nexon, you have a test servwer, try all this things out, open the test server to players, like many other games(Rainbow 6 has a test server where players can try the new features and developers can collect data of it and adjust the new content they want to introduce) , there is no shame in letting the community help when designing or improving a game, heck even KMS allows players to try the test server, why not GMS?
    Also test servers are to try crazy ideas and see if it works or no, just try more stuff, like any of the suggestions we say on this section of the forum, it harms no one i believe.