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Regarding New Ban Policy

Duc_Duc_
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edited November 2016 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
Let's start with me saying yes I understand if you're caught using third party programs you should be banned, regardless I'm still going to pitch my line of thought on this because I botted momentarily to help farm mesos in reboot a little under a year ago and was banned permanently. Which brings me to my problem with the new policy. How are you going to go from banning accounts permanently to a new system where people blatantly hacking get, one, two, three or four slaps on the wrist before being banned. I understand if this new policy is to try to persuade individuals caught using third party programs to stop and play legitimately but there's people who get whispered by 4 different GM's checking if they're botting to only let them go again and again, and on the off chance they were unlucky as to not be ready to reply or close their game they receive a two week ban. My only suggestion is that like several years back where hundreds or thousands of accounts were given a second chance regardless of what hacks they were using, is to review accounts that were caught botting specifically on the old policy and adjust their punishment based on this new system. And yes this sounds absurd to unban people hacking, this is mainly for my account in reboot to be unbanned. It wouldn't directly impact other players because the account would be off rankings and would be flagged to be checked up on by GM's like the people hacking today. So why not give people who were never given these opportunities their chance, now, since this new policy is in effect(or just my account because ya know, that'd be cool).

Comments

  • KeepComingBackKeepComingBack
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    edited November 2016
    So this isn't a real suggestion but more of a ban appeal for your personal account because other people are botting more than you did and they haven't gotten perma'd yet.
    Funny thing is that the slap-on-the-wrist was the old policy and supposedly the new one was gonna be stricter (with permanent removal of rankings etc). It just hasn't been enforced a whole lot lately from the looks of many maps...

    Don't do the crime if you can't do the time, mate.
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • ASoggyRatASoggyRat
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    edited November 2016
    KeepComingBack
    KeepComingBack said:

    So this isn't a real suggestion but more of a ban appeal for your personal account because other people are botting more than you did and they haven't gotten perma'd yet.
    Funny thing is that the slap-on-the-wrist was the old policy and supposedly the new one was gonna be stricter (with permanent removal of rankings etc). It just hasn't been enforced a whole lot lately from the looks of many maps...

    Don't do the crime if you can't do the time, mate.
    I have to agree with this. If people playing exclusively single player or private multiplayer games want to use cheats, mods, hacks or anything else you'd like to call them, that's totally fine. They're only affecting their own gameplay experience or that of their friends, and if that's how they'd prefer to play those type of games, they're free to do whatever they want with their time. But any form of cheating in a public multiplayer game like an MMO deserves to be dealt with harshly. At that point you're always going to be negatively affecting how someone else plays or is able to play the game, and that just isn't fair, nor is it fun for those players affected.
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    What you guys are saying is right, but that doesn't change the fact this is all so a REQUEST sub-forum and what I'm requesting is to extend this policy to also give those banned permanently their warning mainly in reboot as their won't be a change in the economy(since their is none), only server activity. I understand those hacking should be banned but I'm still going to push this request until it gets formally denied because I have nothing better to do at the moment. It still seems like a plausible scenario as those accounts would still be kept off rankings allowing players who compete through ranks or want to keep a legitimate guild what they want, increase the population even if its only by 1, me, and if they'll still be flagged by GM's as per their current policy. Granted it then provides them more work but it would still have the possible outcome of players coming back and continue playing without infringing the ToS this time around.
  • forumsareannoyingforumsareannoying
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    edited November 2016
    Duc_
    Duc_ said:

    What you guys are saying is right, but that doesn't change the fact this is all so a REQUEST sub-forum and what I'm requesting is to extend this policy to also give those banned permanently their warning mainly in reboot as their won't be a change in the economy(since their is none), only server activity. I understand those hacking should be banned but I'm still going to push this request until it gets formally denied because I have nothing better to do at the moment. It still seems like a plausible scenario as those accounts would still be kept off rankings allowing players who compete through ranks or want to keep a legitimate guild what they want, increase the population even if its only by 1, me, and if they'll still be flagged by GM's as per their current policy. Granted it then provides them more work but it would still have the possible outcome of players coming back and continue playing without infringing the ToS this time around.
    Why don't you just go play a ps. I bet you've been hacking on a different account but are hoping Nexon can unban your main account. Yeah, how about we REQUEST nexon to implement a permanent ip ban on hackers. Or something like in KMS where Maple accounts are linked to our government ID.
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • ASoggyRatASoggyRat
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    edited November 2016
    Duc_
    Duc_ said:

    What you guys are saying is right, but that doesn't change the fact this is all so a REQUEST sub-forum and what I'm requesting is to extend this policy to also give those banned permanently their warning mainly in reboot as their won't be a change in the economy(since their is none), only server activity. I understand those hacking should be banned but I'm still going to push this request until it gets formally denied because I have nothing better to do at the moment. It still seems like a plausible scenario as those accounts would still be kept off rankings allowing players who compete through ranks or want to keep a legitimate guild what they want, increase the population even if its only by 1, me, and if they'll still be flagged by GM's as per their current policy. Granted it then provides them more work but it would still have the possible outcome of players coming back and continue playing without infringing the ToS this time around.
    Part of the problem is that unbanning people that have used hacks or bots to train is allowing people that have levelled characters extremely easily and quickly to still use those high level characters that they cheated to earn, which isn't fair on players that legitimately earned their levels through lots of grinding and hard work. It'd be letting everyone get away with blatantly breaking the terms of service, and I wouldn't think it likely to ever happen.

    There's also not much reason to believe that people that haven't broken the terms of service before won't do so again. All anyone at Nexon would really have to go by is the player's word that they wouldn't do something they've agreed not to do, but that's exactly what you were doing in the first place by playing in such a way that breaks the terms of service and affects other players.

    I imagine even if this were ever likely to happen (which I wouldn't think so in a hundred years), it'd take a lot of staff time to find every account that was banned from before the policy changes and manually lift the bans on all of them, and then contact those players to let them know their accounts have been unbanned. This would be a huge waste of staff time and money, as most of the players that have been banned for botting or similar things would have either moved on to another game by now and have no interest in returning, or would be already playing on another account.

    I'm going to make one more suggestion here; your best bet is to simply start again. Make a new account, or use a different account, and play legitimately. Have fun with the game and join our community. Whatever you lost by being banned for hacking you could earn back through natural means, and it feels much more rewarding to see your character reach higher levels and complete quests and content naturally than what it does to just cheat and have everything given to you.
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    You say a hundred years for something like this to happen but It's already happened back in 2013 and 2014 for the same exact reason that they changed their policy and reviewed accounts that were first time offenders and allowed them a second chance(Probably won't find the official post anymore, seems like it 404'd). I've been around since beta so yeah I know the whole, start a new account, etc, etc, been there done it after I lost the info for my account in scania which brought me to reboot. This isn't the most far off request, just like 3 or 4 years ago they implemented a new policy against botters I would just like them to be consistent with how they managed policy changes in the past, to review what accounts were banned for and to adjust their punishment to the current system.

    To address your point on selling these accounts, yes, that is a possibility but with how accounts get flagged and periodical account checks I'm sure it'll be caught using multiple IP addresses and will be banned for sharing.

    As for your point about trust this is a quote from the second chance notice I was talking about regarding the percentage they gathered on those who re-offended, "Out of the thousands of players unbanned in this amnesty, less than 2\% reoffended, while the others were converted into positive players", I won't be linking the source for this as I'm not up to date with what you can and can't redirect to but if you'd like to know for yourself you can just search maplestory and second chance.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited November 2016
    Honestly bud, your first mistake was coming here and saying "I got banned for hacking". That basically cemented the way in which everyone would reply to this thread. Things like "you got what was coming", "deal with it nerd", "hackers suck why should you get unbanned on your main account?" and so on.

    And judging by this last post of yours, you're trying to 'request' that you be given that oft-memed second chance that hackers got two or three years ago because "even god forgives". Honestly I'd have to throw my lot in with the others. You hacked, you got banned. End of.
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    I already knew the direction this thread will go and I don't see the point of not pushing this further as I have nothing to lose since I'm already banned. You guys on the other hand have yet to post anything of substance other than the popular opinion of, if you hacked you got what you deserved. If there's critical points that would stop this scenario from occurring I'd like to hear it but there's already precedent and all the same criteria have been hit. What I don't understand is the opinion that unbanning people that have hacked would be detrimental to reboots community. If people are going to use hacks, they're going to use it regardless if you unban them or not it's just that simple to do these days, if I wanted to continue hacking I would, the resources are there, even premade accounts with 30b+ mesos are out there ready to be bought to seamlessly blend into the community like, "I too legitimately obtained all this, hehe". At least with this you know whose hacked and have an easy way to track them as they're already flagged because they would have served a "30-day" ban essentially with the next offense resulting in a permanent ban as per the current policy on people caught botting( In reality it's more like 4 nudges and a 2 week ban).
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited November 2016
    Here's a critical point that'll stop this scenario from occurring: don't hack!
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    Aggraphine
    Aggraphine said:

    Here's a critical point that'll stop this scenario from occurring: don't hack!
    So not hacking will stop the possibility of being given a second chance, okay, got it.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited November 2016
    Duc_
    Duc_ said:

    Aggraphine
    Aggraphine said:

    Here's a critical point that'll stop this scenario from occurring: don't hack!
    So not hacking will stop the possibility of being given a second chance, okay, got it.
    Yea, that's exactly right, cause if you didn't hack you wouldn't need a second chance to begin with, thus preventing you from getting a second chance or even being in a situation where you would need one.

    you will have to learn to live with the consequences of your actions, and I know you really are not sorry that you botted, you are just sorry you got caught and have to suffer the consequences. You make it abundantly clear.

    but sure, lets get @KThxBaiNao or @OneLetter in here to give you some insight.
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    Oh, very nice hindsight. If only I could go back in time to live a righteous life like you have, oh woe is me. Man, "live with the consequences", are you playing hypothetical situations in your head as to how long I've been banned? I was banned back in January 2016, its been like 10 months, I'm living with the consequences fine. No one seems to want to accept the fact that this is something that was done before and has a slim but not impossible chance to happen again. Instead you guys are gung-ho about posting, "Yeah, he's a hacker?! He should be banned!!!" instead of actually getting up to speed about all the facts I've posted. And yes this scenario is personally beneficial, so is everything anyone suggests.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited November 2016
    How does getting banned for hacking have a "slim but not impossible" chance of happening again? Was one ban not sufficient for you to think "welp, not gonna do that again!"? You get banned once, back in January, and you think going forward from there "well you know, I don't know, maybe"?
    MakazeKibacarmenpop22
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    Do you even know what you're talking about? Let me re-iterate what I've been saying this entire thread.

    - I was banned during January 2016 permanently after caught botting (1st Offense).
    - As of this post there's a new ban policy on those caught botting(1 or 2 warning then scaling ban durations)
    - Using the past "Second Chance" unban wave back in 2013/2014 I'm establishing precedence
    - With this precedence I would like them to review accounts caught botting back in January who were not given ANY warnings an appropriate punishment under their new policy.

    I hope this helps you understand what this thread is about.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited November 2016
    Duc_
    Duc_ said:

    Do you even know what you're talking about? Let me re-iterate what I've been saying this entire thread.

    - I was banned during January 2016 permanently after caught botting (1st Offense). k
    - As of this post there's a new ban policy on those caught botting(1 or 2 warning then scaling ban durations) Did they say, at any point, that this new policy would be applied retroactively?
    - Using the past "Second Chance" unban wave back in 2013/2014 I'm establishing precedence herp derp I should be unbanned because even god forgives
    - With this precedence I would like them to review accounts caught botting back in January who were not given ANY warnings an appropriate punishment under their new policy. Again, if this "new ban policy" you keep citing says nothing about being applied retroactively, then you're SOL. But maybe you should've contact support about this, instead of opening yourself up to the tirade of "oh well sux 2 suk" from people on the forums

    I hope this helps you understand what this thread is about.
    Replies in bold

    And honestly? I already understand what this thread is about. You hacked, you got banned, you're pointing to the "even god forgives" unban wave of two years hence and crying "THEY GOT UNBANNED, WHY CAN'T I GET UNBANNED TOO?".
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    Previous policies never claimed to be retroactive but if you've read the post they made when they announced that past offenders would be amnestied, they made a change in their policies and reviewed those past cases and adjusted their punishments as such. If you don't think that situation can't be used as precedent for what I'm proposing now, then there's not much else to say.
  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited November 2016
    Honestly it more than likely said that past offenders would be looked at as a case-by-case basis and amnesties would be given where applicable, and you're probably just cherry-picking what suits your purposes.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Duc_Duc_
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    edited November 2016
    Aggraphine
    Aggraphine said:

    Honestly it more than likely said that past offenders would be looked at as a case-by-case basis and amnesties would be given where applicable, and you're probably just cherry-picking what suits your purposes.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    You could do some research as I have provided all the information you would need to fact check anything I've said or you can be lazy and prejudice.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


  • AkihikoT_AkihikoT_
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    edited November 2016
    I personally believe if they're giving hackers multiple chances they should deleted all the characters from the hacker and let them play again. That way any friends they had could still find them, but they wouldn't have anything they might of hacked to get.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited November 2016
    Duc_
    Duc_ said:

    Oh, very nice hindsight. If only I could go back in time to live a righteous life like you have, oh woe is me. Man, "live with the consequences", are you playing hypothetical situations in your head as to how long I've been banned? I was banned back in January 2016, its been like 10 months, I'm living with the consequences fine. No one seems to want to accept the fact that this is something that was done before and has a slim but not impossible chance to happen again. Instead you guys are gung-ho about posting, "Yeah, he's a hacker?! He should be banned!!!" instead of actually getting up to speed about all the facts I've posted. And yes this scenario is personally beneficial, so is everything anyone suggests.
    It's not "living a righteous life" it's called not being stupid.

    Nexon was soft on hackers before, which is what allowed you (and others) to conceive this idea that you could hack/ bot and be fine and that if you did get caught "Nexon will give me a second chance and all will be fine"

    dont cry to me about "Do you have any idea how long i've been banned?!" I nor anyone else cares about how long you've been banned, the perm ban on your account should stay the way it is. Your ban was not a 10 month ban, it was a Perm ban. Make a new account if you want to play again, give it a few months and you may even get your IGN's back from a name cleansing, shouldn't take you too long to get back to where you were on Reboot. Living with the consequences entails living with the result of your actions, which in this case means living with the Perm ban you received, not begging for your account to be unbanned.