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Don't nerf the drop rate system like KMS did

thrakkesthrakkes
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edited June 2017 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
This is the KMS patch from orangemushroom.net blog:
https://orangemushroom.net/2017/03/29/kms-ver-1-2-275-game-related-changes-colourful-maple/

I really don't know exactly how the new drop rate system from potential works at this patch, but I heard that even with the base drop rate increase of Nodestones for people who have with a very high amount of %drop it would affect their drop rate a lot. Even a bit lower than half amount of their usual farming.

Thought this change would be ok for KMS because the drop from monsters are totally tradeable, for us in GMS it's not the case. Our Nodestones from monster drops are tradeable in account. I don't ask to make Nodestones from mob tradeable but to not change the drop rate system. Not just for Nodestones, but also cubes from bosses or even farming Kritias Invasion and more!

*Unrelated* Change the required amount of equips for Lucky Item to be applied in set from 3 to 2 plz :P
  1. Do you prefer to not nerf drop rate system due to fact Nodestones are transferable within account ?70 votes
    1. Omg yes! I want keep our current drop rate system!!!!
       77% (54 votes)
    2. No. Even if we answer yes, I feel Nexon would change it anyways...
       23% (16 votes)

Comments

  • thrakkesthrakkes
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    edited June 2017
    Also, some people who have intention to answer no to this poll, we would like to hear your opinion.
  • PetalmagicPetalmagic
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    edited June 2017
    While I really don't want the nerf...I am on the side that "Nexon will change it anyway despite player outcry"
  • LilyflowerLilyflower
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    edited June 2017
    I agree with petalmagic I to don't want a nerf of nodestone drop rate but nexon america will change it definitely.
  • IvangoldIvangold
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    edited June 2017
    I would prefer they simply made the drop rate like exp, a sum of all instead of multiplication like it's now(exp used to be like this too), this would slow down the drop of nodes, but still not the abysmal diference that happened in KMS.
  • SaisSais
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    edited June 2017
    The base nodestone drop rate is actually getting increased. The way drop rates in general stack up is what's getting changed. It actually balances out nodestone distribution somewhat among funded and unfunded players. Funded players with absurd amounts of drop rate stats on their gear will have a much harder time than before to gather nodestones while people who lack those resources will have an easier time getting nodestones. So in short, it slightly evens out the playing field. Although I don't see why it was necessary to change how drop rates stacked up in the first place because now it makes things even more confusing than before. Especially since it was never explained how it's going to be calculated now.
    DarkPassenger
  • RollsRolls
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    edited June 2017
    Sais wrote: »
    it slightly evens out the playing field.

    Again with this "evening out the playing field", "decreasing the gap between the rich and poor"
    Making it harder for people above you doesn't make it easier for you. Changing the way you see it's not going to change the fact that it will be harder to get nodestones in general. The first general increase will benefit everyone, the nerf will be a huge detriment to those already situated with drop rate. And then prices will start to rise, due to a decrease in supply of nodestones. And then botters will abuse that to profit even more.

    That's not even accounting for that even if it was a benefit to less funded players for nodestones, this will lower drop rate to symbols, droplet stones, event items, basically everything important. The drop rate nerf isn't just about nodes. The current system is fine. It doesn't need a nerf.

    And nodestones aren't something that's supposed to be very rare and very valuable. They're something you need thousands of to max out on, at least a few hundred to get to just a decent place with in terms of progression. I'm convinced Nexon thinks that one individual nodestone is worth at least 1b.
    LShadow3Lilyflowerdarik
  • PeepPeep
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    edited June 2017
    Don't know why Nexon feels the need to change things that are already fine and never complained about...
    pepedarik
  • SaisSais
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    edited June 2017
    Rolls wrote: »
    Sais wrote: »
    it slightly evens out the playing field.

    Again with this "evening out the playing field", "decreasing the gap between the rich and poor"
    Making it harder for people above you doesn't make it easier for you. Changing the way you see it's not going to change the fact that it will be harder to get nodestones in general. The first general increase will benefit everyone, the nerf will be a huge detriment to those already situated with drop rate. And then prices will start to rise, due to a decrease in supply of nodestones. And then botters will abuse that to profit even more.

    That's not even accounting for that even if it was a benefit to less funded players for nodestones, this will lower drop rate to symbols, droplet stones, event items, basically everything important. The drop rate nerf isn't just about nodes. The current system is fine. It doesn't need a nerf.

    And nodestones aren't something that's supposed to be very rare and very valuable. They're something you need thousands of to max out on, at least a few hundred to get to just a decent place with in terms of progression. I'm convinced Nexon thinks that one individual nodestone is worth at least 1b.

    Yes, I understand all that. Nexon has always made higher level/end-game items extremely troublesome to get. The harder it is for us to gain something, the more time (and possibly money) we have to invest in the game to achieve it. But that's exactly what Nexon wants. So they can keep their players playing their game as long as possible to reap the most potential profit.

    Look at the legion system for example. To reap the best benefits, you have to get every single character to MAX level. That is not something you can achieve unless you play for an enormous amount of time. And with the introduction of of the Legion system, they started selling character creation options up to lv150 to make profit off of the lazy people who don't want to invest the time to make new characters from scratch.

    Adjusting the drop rates is exactly the kind of thing Nexon would do, so that people would have more of an incentive to purchase 2x coupons from the cash shop to optimize their drop rate chances. And there has been no word or confirmation on how exactly it works which I feel is kind of shady on Nexon's part since they had no trouble explaining roughly how newly adjusted character stats stacked up such as Monster DEF ignore % and status resistance.
  • DiscordOfColorsDiscordOfColors
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    edited June 2017
    Rolls wrote: »
    Sais wrote: »
    it slightly evens out the playing field.

    Again with this "evening out the playing field", "decreasing the gap between the rich and poor"
    Making it harder for people above you doesn't make it easier for you. Changing the way you see it's not going to change the fact that it will be harder to get nodestones in general. The first general increase will benefit everyone, the nerf will be a huge detriment to those already situated with drop rate. And then prices will start to rise, due to a decrease in supply of nodestones. And then botters will abuse that to profit even more.
    while it doesn't make it easier for the common player it does make it feel like there's some hope and that this game isn't corrupted to the core. sure it will make nodestones more expensive and right now it seems like its never gonna be a reasonable price it will eventually even out, just like with mastery books back in the day.

    [/quote]That's not even accounting for that even if it was a benefit to less funded players for nodestones, this will lower drop rate to symbols, droplet stones, event items, basically everything important. [/quote] "everything that's important" isn't exactly accurate, these items aren't really a must except nodestone, the only boss that still drops actual equips is like magnus the rest drop those stupid use or etc items that can be turned in for equips and those mostly aren't effected TOO MUCH by drop rate.

    [/quote]And nodestones aren't something that's supposed to be very rare and very valuable. [/quote] c'mon...... nodestones will make you do x2 if not x3 damage when maxed. and its something you'll continue to get throughout your adventure to 250...
    Sais wrote: »
    Yes, I understand all that. Nexon has always made higher level/end-game items extremely troublesome to get. The harder it is for us to gain something, the more time (and possibly money) we have to invest in the game to achieve it. But that's exactly what Nexon wants. So they can keep their players playing their game as long as possible to reap the most potential profit.

    Look at the legion system for example. To reap the best benefits, you have to get every single character to MAX level. That is not something you can achieve unless you play for an enormous amount of time. And with the introduction of of the Legion system, they started selling character creation options up to lv150 to make profit off of the lazy people who don't want to invest the time to make new characters from scratch.

    Adjusting the drop rates is exactly the kind of thing Nexon would do, so that people would have more of an incentive to purchase 2x coupons from the cash shop to optimize their drop rate chances. And there has been no word or confirmation on how exactly it works which I feel is kind of shady on Nexon's part since they had no trouble explaining roughly how newly adjusted character stats stacked up such as Monster DEF ignore % and status resistance.
    you just contradicted yourself multiple times there, im sure people spend WAY more money on cubes trying to get legendary and even more on single or double drop rate lines. also, they make it hard for high end because its gonna keep those people in game for longer so that will make them and most likely other's to spend more money


    edit: for the record im certainly against the drop rate changes.
  • AznboiEAznboiE
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    edited June 2017
    They should have just added all the drop rate potentials and buffs into 1 multiplier instead... That's where it was broken in the first place.
    Players on 2x Event drop, 2x drop card, and 2x drop coupons already get 8x drop. Assuming a player has 4 blackgate rings with 20% drop each, that multiplies it by another 1.2*1.2*1.2*1.2, Thats a crazy 16.5x drop. Some people take it further by getting 2 20% drop potentials on ONE ring and drop on face accessories...

    If those drop rate potentials were additive before multiplied into coupons event and card, it'd be only 14.4x, still high, but deminishing returns take effect.

    If possible, 4, 40% drop rings = 2.6x drop multiplied by 8x drop = only >20x where as it would stand being a multiplier at >30x drop

  • thrakkesthrakkes
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    edited June 2017
    AznboiE wrote: »
    They should have just added all the drop rate potentials and buffs into 1 multiplier instead... That's where it was broken in the first place.
    Players on 2x Event drop, 2x drop card, and 2x drop coupons already get 8x drop. Assuming a player has 4 blackgate rings with 20% drop each, that multiplies it by another 1.2*1.2*1.2*1.2, Thats a crazy 16.5x drop. Some people take it further by getting 2 20% drop potentials on ONE ring and drop on face accessories...

    If those drop rate potentials were additive before multiplied into coupons event and card, it'd be only 14.4x, still high, but deminishing returns take effect.

    If possible, 4, 40% drop rings = 2.6x drop multiplied by 8x drop = only >20x where as it would stand being a multiplier at >30x drop

    Are you saying the current %drop potential lines are multiplicative to each other? o-0 I thought they were all additive.


    Anyways, this new calculation will also affect other in-game items not just nodestones/symbols/droplet.
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited June 2017
    I understand it as, you dont need much drop rate to benefit from drop rate.

    Means rich or poor, you can save mesos and cubes for something else and not stock up on drop gear. thats why I voted no. it's a simple change.
  • PirateIzzyPirateIzzy
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    edited June 2017
    What people are neglecting to remember with the drop rate change is that Nodestones aren't the only item people hunt for. Other items include Arcane Symbols, cubes, Soul Shards, and various types of equipment.
    darik
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited June 2017
    The changes to drop rate basically translate to "less is more"
  • PeepPeep
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    edited June 2017
    Sais wrote: »
    The base nodestone drop rate is actually getting increased. The way drop rates in general stack up is what's getting changed. It actually balances out nodestone distribution somewhat among funded and unfunded players. Funded players with absurd amounts of drop rate stats on their gear will have a much harder time than before to gather nodestones while people who lack those resources will have an easier time getting nodestones. So in short, it slightly evens out the playing field. Although I don't see why it was necessary to change how drop rates stacked up in the first place because now it makes things even more confusing than before. Especially since it was never explained how it's going to be calculated now.

    Increased, but the end result is still a nerf with how drop rate is calculated after the change. Punishing funded players for making good investments in drop gear isn't a good thing. When you spend billions to invest in drop gear you obviously want to see a return. The way drop rate works currently in our version is perfect and never needed changing. The way drop rate is going to work after the change is horrible.

    This was also in the notes.

    "For some items, quest items, and event items, drop rate increasing effects will now only be partially applied."

    How horrible. So now quests, events and some other stuff will be taking a hit too.

    It's not hard to get drop gear even as someone unfunded and you benefit nicely from it now. After the change....good luck.

    darik
  • illruminatiillruminati
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    edited June 2017
    I dont know to what extent you guys follow KMS but that March update was changed again in KMS due to community outrage. So worst case scenario, we get it worse for a while then good again. In regards to nodestones. I dont understand that such an important thing is close to impossible to get for a free to play player. And when Nexon have nodestones included in some hyped up "expansion" they give players 1 nodestone. Clearly indicates to me they lack "endgame" understanding of the game.
    I dont see why a few e.g. 5 nodestones cant be added to daily symbol quest in vanishing jurney or chuchu pq. So that players that dont have insane dropprate atleast over time can feel like they get some kind of progress. Say doing vj and chuchu gave a total of 10 nodestones. It still takes a few 100's to max 1 node to 25. Put in a grind perspective. you would have to grind maby 5-600hrs to get the nodestones "no dropprate gear" to max 1 skill.
    Its2Sharp4Udarik
  • RollsRolls
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    edited June 2017
    I dont see why a few e.g. 5 nodestones cant be added to daily symbol quest in vanishing jurney or chuchu pq. So that players that dont have insane dropprate atleast over time can feel like they get some kind of progress.

    This. I'd love to see being able to choose between nodes and symbols, or at least, when you already have a symbol maxed, the dailies for it give nodestones instead, so they're not completely useless. And in general, it'd be great if everything were much less dependent on drop rate, and in that case, the nerf wouldn't hit as hard, but for as long as there is no daily quests that give nodestones or droplet stones, this nerf, should it come to GMS, will make things much harder for everyone.
    Its2Sharp4UPetalmagicdarik
  • thrakkesthrakkes
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    edited July 2017
    PirateIzzy wrote: »
    What people are neglecting to remember with the drop rate change is that Nodestones aren't the only item people hunt for. Other items include Arcane Symbols, cubes, Soul Shards, and various types of equipment.

    Exactly this^^ Nexon can't do this unless we increase drop rate of most items. Also, most players want keep our current drop rate system.
    darik
  • ManiOhManiOh
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    edited July 2017
    many things are broken anyway + they do copy/paste 90% of the things from KMS and small %just get "edit/change " to fit GMS needs and thats where the mess begins at those "edits/changes"
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited July 2017
    ManiOh wrote: »
    many things are broken anyway + they do copy/paste 90% of the things from KMS and small %just get "edit/change " to fit GMS needs and thats where the mess begins at those "edits/changes"

    you play combat arms too right, i think i saw you on forums