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Please keep P2W out of Reboot

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  • RollsRolls
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    edited May 2017
    Xeratetsu wrote: »
    Rolls wrote: »
    With MVP, it was pretty minimal, 30 minute 30 att/matk (I think it was) buffs and 1.5x exp (which is pretty bad considering how common 2x coupons are now)
    So I can't say I really have an opinion on that

    Paying for an advantage, however minimal, goes against the entire purpose of reboot. just because a 30 att/matt buff and some 1.5x coupons are a small advantage, it still just that little difference that quite literally makes all the difference.

    Eh, I suppose that was more my reason for not paying too much attention to it, but I'll have to agree
    Paid advantages shouldn't be in Reboot at all
    And once again, they'd learn to keep doing it if it gets by
    Xeratetsu
  • SoephaaiSoephaai
    Reactions: 775
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    edited May 2017
    Really disappointed by this move, hope Nexon will re-think their decision and remove the NX option from the reboot world completely. It doesn't make sense if after 1.5 years of non-p2w you start ruining the server by a simple cash-grab, you're pissing off a lot of people.
    DemiheartRoseoleHiroki05PissedOff
  • lodwyvernlodwyvern
    Reactions: 1,960
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    edited May 2017
    This is a really poor move for reboot if nexon goes through with it. Reboot's managed to avoid many pay to win aspects, but this one is blatantly giving an advantage to people with the ability so spend as much as they need to in order to receive the medal. I believe many players think that the NX option for the reverie box should completely miss reboot.

    The box for mesos is a step in the right direction, however, the price is extremely prohibitive for casual and hardcore players alike. If I grind myself into the ground I can purchase 1 box every 2 hours, but the chance that I receive a soul enchanter (an item I find stacks of when grinding in arcane river) for 500m is just ridiculous and dissatisfying. Not every player will be willing or even able to farm out 500m per box. Shaving a zero off that figure would be much more appropriate as the average player could afford one after completing their daily bosses or a session of Ursus happy hour.

    Keep NX boxes out of reboot please! Reduce the price to at max 50m meso!
  • ShadEightShadEight
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    edited May 2017
    SadVirgin wrote: »
    The box in general is overpriced for the pool of items it offers, and it's only one item per box. They're simply not worth it for the NX price either.

    Exactly this. 40 bucks for 11 boxes of essentially philo book + 1% chance of medals is a blatant scam.

    But yes it is quite sad to see that it's being offered NX in reboot, which was meant to be a non-p2w server. However I don't think it's as worrying to me as the meso tag on the box. It takes me a day to farm 500m, but I don't play hours on end so at most I will have just 15-20 tries during the whole event. And I get the feeling that I will be disappointed if I attempt it.

    This event is wrong in so many ways.
  • xOtakuxOtaku
    Reactions: 1,355
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    edited May 2017
    If Nexon were to put the boxes in reboot for mesos only, they need to know that a normal kanna without meso rate equips/inner ability and being able to find a channel in ghost ship 2 can only make 90~120mil per hour.
  • XeratetsuXeratetsu
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    edited May 2017
    xOtaku wrote: »
    If Nexon were to put the boxes in reboot for mesos only, they need to know that a normal kanna without meso rate equips/inner ability and being able to find a channel in ghost ship 2 can only make 90~120mil per hour.

    This coupled with that fact that there are a good portion of people that dont farm for mesos because they dont have the time to spend and just use daily bosses and 2x ursus for their daily dose of cash. At best the average player that spends time to do daily bosses and grind a decent amout will only make 300-500m a day, making a box that should go for 40m a piece sit at a price of 500m is the epitome of idiotic.
  • PryycePryyce
    Reactions: 440
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    edited May 2017
    Having these boxes listed for NX in Reboot is hugely disrespectful to the players. Nexon is perfectly aware of how adverse the community is to P2W in Reboot - which they have learned from experience. Continuing to introduce P2W aspects until they are rejected by the community is evidence of their lack of respect for a premise that was introduced by Nexon itself. It demonstrates that they are not willing to support the fundamental rules of Reboot and will only do so in order to avoid major backlash from the community.

    Nexon has done a great job of maintaining non-P2W up until now, but this isn't the first time they have tested us - and if this gets through it will be a pivotal moment for the server. To all those saying it's not a big deal, or it's just one time - you're wrong. Not only are we talking about a best-in-slot item here, but if Nexon gets away with this once, these tests will come more and more frequently and soon enough there will be a total lack of integrity with regards to Reboot.
    xOtakuRoseoleCuzMeHiroki05
  • iamfulliamfull
    Reactions: 540
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    edited May 2017
    I with I found out about this thread earlier.

    I agree with the OP on this one. To be honest, if the event just said "Hey guys, we're going to make the items 500m for your items, and not have an NX option." I think I would be pretty mad at the event.

    I really hope this is all just a publicity stunt, and they're actually smart enough to realize that Reboot players do not want any Pay-To-Win aspects added into the server, and put this up, just so they can remove the NX option before it goes live and show the Reboot community "Hey, we're totally listening to you guys, and since you guys voiced your concerns, we're showing you guys that we are listening." If this is what you guys are planning to do. Bravo. We got played.

    However, if this actually does go live. Oh boy, what a [Censored]show you guys are going to have.

    But again, with the OP on this, Conjurer's Cache and MVP rewards were things I was against but I didn't really voice my concerns, but I think I should've done this before. And before you reply with "Oh but Conjurer's Cache doesn't do have items that add stats!", that is true, but the fact that you can get 20 slot herb / mineral bags from this is what makes me mad. If items that would affect gameplay outside of a purely cosmetic point of view, I don't think its acceptable for them to have an NX option for it in Reboot.
  • SDMagicSDMagic
    Reactions: 410
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    edited May 2017
    Listen, Nexon, my dudes, don't do this. Y'all tried to profit off of P2W on reboot in the beginning with literally paying for progression through meso sacks. If that was met with severe backlash why would this box containing mostly useless items with a best in slot item hidden somewhere in the rewards list not receive the same backlash? Like, if this box was meant to be bait to ween reboot off of no p2w then you at least could have tried harder with the rewards, as it is it only makes more people upset with it. But yeah, remove the option to buy it in reboot with nx and lower the dang price of this andersen's box with anime makeup on it.
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited May 2017
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?
  • ErikuzumaErikuzuma
    Reactions: 100
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    edited May 2017
    Agreed. The whole point of Reboot is that everyone has the same advantages and disadvantages. Adding a P2W event to the world doesn't seem like a big deal at first, but in the long run it simply encourages more and more P2W. "Hey remember that time we added a P2W thing on Reboot and it was fine? Let's do it again!" or "Just one more time, I'm sure it's gonna be fine" and such things. The best course of action in my opinion is not adding the P2W in the first place. And mind you, I don't even play Reboot that much. The only character over Lv 100 I have there was from the burning event.
  • PuddingplaysPuddingplays
    Reactions: 600
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    edited May 2017
    I don't play reboot, but I believe the availability to buy the box with NX in reboot should be removed.
    The medals aren't going to make or break your damage/range/xp gain by a large amount, or anything...
    However, the idea of gaining any amount of damage, no matter how big or how small from the use of NX, goes against what reboot is.
    Anybody who doesn't see it is thick skulled.
  • TsukiBakaTsukiBaka
    Reactions: 1,410
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    edited May 2017
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    You've got to be kidding me. I've been reading all your posts and my goodness, are you serious?

    Reboot users complain about the price because it's absurd. That's enough said. Regardless of the other issue (which is the NX), the fact that 500m per box being absolutely ridiculous is still true. "Isn't it safe to assume they'd be overpriced", 4k NX to equal 500m is not the rate, nor is it standard for Reboot pricing whatsoever. It doesn't make any sense at all, in which Nexon simply just threw numbers in, OR made a retarded typo (which I doubt). These boxes are 100% in the pay2win category, what about this is so hard for you to process? In terms of Maplestory, anything that gives a user a easier rode to a huge stat advantage through the process of using actual life currency is a pay 2 win aspect, not to mention other simple things that is basically a pay 2 win aspect.

    Your logic is seriously flawed in every single way. Never allow users to pay for these kinds of advantages in Reboot. That is the very point of Reboot.
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited May 2017
    I don't play reboot, but I believe the availability to buy the box with NX in reboot should be removed.
    The medals aren't going to make or break your damage/range/xp gain by a large amount, or anything...
    However, the idea of gaining any amount of damage, no matter how big or how small, goes against what reboot is.
    Anybody who doesn't see it is thick skulled.

    in a limitless game, say that if there was a damage cap
  • XeratetsuXeratetsu
    Reactions: 1,050
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    edited May 2017
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    Why complain you ask? We complain because when nexon does something shitty to its community because they want to just blatantly rip them off we're gonna say something. whether the vocal ones are a minority, or a majority(like in this case). The community isnt that same complicit little group that it used to be and when the company that runs it throws us and event that just a blatant slap in the face to the largest part of its community we're not gonna take it sitting down. Nexon isnt special, they're not gonna get special treatment and be allowed to give a big middle finger to all of reboot.

    Its the same situation if blizzard were to so some shady things to its customers in wow or any of their other game, they'd get called out and the community would group together to get said thing changed. A company doesn't exist without its consumer base,and yeah sure they have plenty of whales that are totally fine with nexon just purposely spitting in their face event after event, but i, and everyone else here that is vocal about nexon not ruining reboot with their p2w tactics like they did with the normal servers. We want reboot to stay as f2p as possible and this event is blatantly against that.
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited May 2017
    Xeratetsu wrote: »
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    Why complain you ask? We complain because when nexon does something shitty to its community because they want to just blatantly rip them off we're gonna say something. whether the vocal ones are a minority, or a majority(like in this case). The community isnt that same complicit little group that it used to be and when the company that runs it throws us and event that just a blatant slap in the face to the largest part of its community we're not gonna take it sitting down. Nexon isnt special, they're not gonna get special treatment and be allowed to give a big middle finger to all of reboot.

    Its the same situation if blizzard were to so some shady things to its customers in wow or any of their other game, they'd get called out and the community would group together to get said thing changed. A company doesn't exist without its consumer base,and yeah sure they have plenty of whales that are totally fine with nexon just purposely spitting in their face event after event, but i, and everyone else here that is vocal about nexon not ruining reboot with their p2w tactics like they did with the normal servers. We want reboot to stay as f2p as possible and this event is blatantly against that.

    let me put it simpler, pay2win = expensive, and f2p = cheap, therefore if they lowert he prices of the boxes from the 500mil, this event is no longer p2w right? so the basis of categorizing this event as pay2win is now solely on the prices of the box? is this event pay2win or not? if it is, why would they make them cheap?
  • KushyDragonKushyDragon
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    edited May 2017
    TsukiBaka wrote: »
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    You've got to be kidding me. I've been reading all your posts and my goodness, are you serious?

    Reboot users complain about the price because it's absurd. That's enough said. Regardless of the other issue (which is the NX), the fact that 500m per box being absolutely ridiculous is still true. "Isn't it safe to assume they'd be overpriced", 4k NX to equal 500m is not the rate, nor is it standard for Reboot pricing whatsoever. It doesn't make any sense at all, in which Nexon simply just threw numbers in, OR made a retarded typo (which I doubt). These boxes are 100% in the pay2win category, what about this is so hard for you to process? In terms of Maplestory, anything that gives a user a easier rode to a huge stat advantage through the process of using actual life currency is a pay 2 win aspect, not to mention other simple things that is basically a pay 2 win aspect.

    Your logic is seriously flawed in every single way. Never allow users to pay for these kinds of advantages in Reboot. That is the very point of Reboot.

    I'll concur to most of the posts in this thread to begin with.

    People don't want pay to win in reboot, as someone who doesn't really play reboot, but I did play in the beginning during the reboot event. It's the most basic and common sense fact. No pay to win in reboot.

    The box price is kind of out there just for one, regardless of if the box is for mesos. 500m for one is kind of insane. I'm no meso farmer, but I figure it probably takes nearly forever, especially if you're not funded or don't have the link skills and character slots, etc.

    The NX Box is an option, not a requirement. The reasons I state this are because do you really need or have to get the medals? It's more of your own personal preference but with my own personal preference I'm fine not really getting the boxes.


    However the first two points are the major ones in this thread, and the third point is just something you can think about.

    Also I was someone who got the Beater Medal in SAO, but I only paid 10$ NX and did my free runs.
  • TsukiBakaTsukiBaka
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    edited May 2017
    Xeratetsu wrote: »
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    Why complain you ask? We complain because when nexon does something shitty to its community because they want to just blatantly rip them off we're gonna say something. whether the vocal ones are a minority, or a majority(like in this case). The community isnt that same complicit little group that it used to be and when the company that runs it throws us and event that just a blatant slap in the face to the largest part of its community we're not gonna take it sitting down. Nexon isnt special, they're not gonna get special treatment and be allowed to give a big middle finger to all of reboot.

    Its the same situation if blizzard were to so some shady things to its customers in wow or any of their other game, they'd get called out and the community would group together to get said thing changed. A company doesn't exist without its consumer base,and yeah sure they have plenty of whales that are totally fine with nexon just purposely spitting in their face event after event, but i, and everyone else here that is vocal about nexon not ruining reboot with their p2w tactics like they did with the normal servers. We want reboot to stay as f2p as possible and this event is blatantly against that.

    let me put it simpler, pay2win = expensive, and f2p = cheap, therefore if they lowert he prices of the boxes from the 500mil, this event is no longer p2w right? so the basis of categorizing this event as pay2win is now solely on the prices of the box? is this event pay2win or not? if it is, why would they make them cheap?

    Do you not understand what pay 2 win means? I think you need to learn what it means.
  • DarkPassengerDarkPassenger
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    edited May 2017
    TsukiBaka wrote: »
    Xeratetsu wrote: »
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    Why complain you ask? We complain because when nexon does something shitty to its community because they want to just blatantly rip them off we're gonna say something. whether the vocal ones are a minority, or a majority(like in this case). The community isnt that same complicit little group that it used to be and when the company that runs it throws us and event that just a blatant slap in the face to the largest part of its community we're not gonna take it sitting down. Nexon isnt special, they're not gonna get special treatment and be allowed to give a big middle finger to all of reboot.

    Its the same situation if blizzard were to so some shady things to its customers in wow or any of their other game, they'd get called out and the community would group together to get said thing changed. A company doesn't exist without its consumer base,and yeah sure they have plenty of whales that are totally fine with nexon just purposely spitting in their face event after event, but i, and everyone else here that is vocal about nexon not ruining reboot with their p2w tactics like they did with the normal servers. We want reboot to stay as f2p as possible and this event is blatantly against that.

    let me put it simpler, pay2win = expensive, and f2p = cheap, therefore if they lowert he prices of the boxes from the 500mil, this event is no longer p2w right? so the basis of categorizing this event as pay2win is now solely on the prices of the box? is this event pay2win or not? if it is, why would they make them cheap?

    Do you not understand what pay 2 win means? I think you need to learn what it means.

    youre talking about a huge stat advantage in a game that has no damage cap. calling it pay2win is a stretch
    even someone that called this pay2win said those that want the boxes will have to farm mesos and if they dont want to why expect to have good items. So even someone on your side of the argument has said you guys will have to farm mesos if you want the boxes.

    and to be clear, mesos in reboot would be valued less than other servers because it is a meso based server, the flow of mesos circulating is more than other servers. if anything these boxes would serve like a meso sink for reboot, even if it's not needed because reboot has no economy, just giving and example of how the value of reboot mesos would be seen if it were like other servers.
  • XeratetsuXeratetsu
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    edited May 2017
    Xeratetsu wrote: »
    Why complain about the price of the boxes if people basically said these boxes are pay2win, isnt it safe to assume theyd be overpriced, isnt something that gains advantage supposed to be expensive? either admit these boxes dont fall into the pay2win category and maybe theyll lower the prices or suck it up and quit complaining, if something gained the advantage you wanted others not to pay for, why would you ask for them to be cheap?

    Why complain you ask? We complain because when nexon does something shitty to its community because they want to just blatantly rip them off we're gonna say something. whether the vocal ones are a minority, or a majority(like in this case). The community isnt that same complicit little group that it used to be and when the company that runs it throws us and event that just a blatant slap in the face to the largest part of its community we're not gonna take it sitting down. Nexon isnt special, they're not gonna get special treatment and be allowed to give a big middle finger to all of reboot.

    Its the same situation if blizzard were to so some shady things to its customers in wow or any of their other game, they'd get called out and the community would group together to get said thing changed. A company doesn't exist without its consumer base,and yeah sure they have plenty of whales that are totally fine with nexon just purposely spitting in their face event after event, but i, and everyone else here that is vocal about nexon not ruining reboot with their p2w tactics like they did with the normal servers. We want reboot to stay as f2p as possible and this event is blatantly against that.

    let me put it simpler, pay2win = expensive, and f2p = cheap, therefore if they lowert he prices of the boxes from the 500mil, this event is no longer p2w right? so the basis of categorizing this event as pay2win is now solely on the prices of the box? is this event pay2win or not? if it is, why would they make them cheap?

    You obviously dont understand what p2w and f2p mean at all, f2p doesn't mean a cheap alternative to p2w, it means there's no real life cost to doing something in the game, period. Being pay to win means someone can come in and drop some amount of money and be at the same endpoint as someone else who actually put in the work to get there. However, in maple it would be more accurate to say the game is pay for power, allowing someone to com in and pay to get further in the game and i could in a reasonable amount of given time.

    f2p means there is no cost to gaining power in the game and allowing the players to all play at the same speed for the same end goal. Giving people a fair and even chance to all be at the end given enough time. Adding things into the game that allow people to pay however much money to gain just that little bit over someone else who wouldnt otherwise be able to obtain said little bit goes against everything reboot was created for. Had you actually played in reboot and understood why the people who play there do play there your little bubble of hate may not exist in the first place.

    this is the essence of reboot, everyone has a fair shot to the end and we want it to stay that way. Allowing nexon to do this, this time, opens doors in the future for them to do it again, many times, because they did it before. And no one in reboot wants to hand nexon the key to that door because we all know what happened to the normal servers because they had the key before.
    IHadTo