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Phone number / ID Card verification for accounts?

LyedenLyeden
Reactions: 1,510
Posts: 61
Member
edited November 2018 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
Hello. I think it'd be a good idea to keep our accounts safe , and maybe avoid hackers by adding an ID and / or phone number attached to our accounts.
so maybe they wouldnt register so many accounts? (over 30k accs banned in the past 2 weeks, said by SavageAce) If these would be required for a registration botters couldnt register so much accs..
What do you think about this?
Lilyflower

Comments

  • AstersAsters
    Reactions: 975
    Posts: 56
    Member
    edited November 2018
    a better solution is IP ban for good period of time. which happens sometimes for people who try logging too many times fast .

    if you have an account with e-mail it needs phone verification already.

    It's no bad having multiple accounts what's worrying is certain IP, locations keep accessing the game after having a previous account blocked permanently.

    i say give them 3 chances if they consume it all. then a total IP block happens forever.
    Lilyflower
  • FuhreakFuhreak
    Reactions: 6,920
    Posts: 1,283
    Member, Private Tester
    edited November 2018
    Lyeden wrote: »
    Hello. I think it'd be a good idea to keep our accounts safe , and maybe avoid hackers by adding an ID and / or phone number attached to our accounts.
    so maybe they wouldnt register so many accounts? (over 30k accs banned in the past 2 weeks, said by SavageAce) If these would be required for a registration botters couldnt register so much accs..
    What do you think about this?

    Absolutely not.
    There are plenty of people who do not have phones, including children.
    Making this a requirement blocks people from playing the game.
    This is punishment to legit players for something hackers are doing.
  • ACMBlackCipherACMBlackCipher
    Reactions: 1,690
    Posts: 104
    Member
    edited November 2018
    Lyeden wrote: »
    Hello. I think it'd be a good idea to keep our accounts safe , and maybe avoid hackers by adding an ID and / or phone number attached to our accounts.
    so maybe they wouldnt register so many accounts? (over 30k accs banned in the past 2 weeks, said by SavageAce) If these would be required for a registration botters couldnt register so much accs..
    What do you think about this?

    Unfortunately, phone numbers can be spoofed and ID's can be counterfeited. There's no way to cross reference this information anyway. The reason why South Korea's system works so well is because they use their SSN which is a unique identifier.
    Absolutely not.
    There are plenty of people who do not have phones, including children.
    Making this a requirement blocks people from playing the game.
    This is punishment to legit players for something hackers are doing.

    Eligibility. You represent that you are not a person barred from receiving the Services under applicable law. You also represent that you either are over the age of majority in your country or, consistent with applicable law, use the Services only with the permission and under the supervision of a parent or legal guardian that has reviewed and agreed to these Terms. Children (as defined under applicable law) may not register for an account and may not provide any personal information to Nexon or others through the Services.

    Clipped from the TOS.

    You have to be either 18 or have parental supervision to play. This is the liability waiver you sign away so there should be no "children" in the game without supervision (from the standpoint of the company).

    People who have computers usually have a phone.

    All that aside, it wouldn't work out well anyway.
  • FuhreakFuhreak
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    Member, Private Tester
    edited November 2018
    Eligibility. You represent that you are not a person barred from receiving the Services under applicable law. You also represent that you either are over the age of majority in your country or, consistent with applicable law, use the Services only with the permission and under the supervision of a parent or legal guardian that has reviewed and agreed to these Terms. Children (as defined under applicable law) may not register for an account and may not provide any personal information to Nexon or others through the Services.

    Clipped from the TOS.

    You have to be either 18 or have parental supervision to play. This is the liability waiver you sign away so there should be no "children" in the game without supervision (from the standpoint of the company).

    People who have computers usually have a phone.

    All that aside, it wouldn't work out well anyway.

    True enough, but we know that's not the case for most kids.
    Even if it was, parents might not want to give their phone number out to some random company on the internet.
    This can also be applied to people who have phones. I'm not giving my phone number to Nexon. They can't have it.

    Certain platforms like Steam already do this for certain features, most people hate it.
    Nexon doesn't need to do anything to upset players even more than they already are with current events.
  • ShadEightShadEight
    Reactions: 3,110
    Posts: 381
    Member
    edited November 2018
    Fuhreak wrote: »
    Absolutely not.
    There are plenty of people who do not have phones, including children.
    Making this a requirement blocks people from playing the game.
    This is punishment to legit players for something hackers are doing.

    Please, every kid I know has a phone now. If you're too young for a phone, you're too young for an online video game. And if you have a computer, then you must certainly have a phone number. It's a legitimate verification process that companies are moving to, the problem is that GMS is a global service and is thus a little tricky to implement such a verification system.
    Asters wrote: »
    a better solution is IP ban for good period of time. which happens sometimes for people who try logging too many times fast .
    if you have an account with e-mail it needs phone verification already.
    It's no bad having multiple accounts what's worrying is certain IP, locations keep accessing the game after having a previous account blocked permanently.
    i say give them 3 chances if they consume it all. then a total IP block happens forever.

    Firstly emails only ask for phone numbers after the first creation by the same IP (this is true for gmail at least). Secondly IP banning is by far the easiest thing to circumvent, all you need to do is reset the router and automatically have the DHCP give you a new IP. And since accounts are not tied to IP (or else we couldn't play at our friends house etc), its job done for the exploiters who probably have their own system of quick IP switching anyway.

    Unfortunately, phone numbers can be spoofed and ID's can be counterfeited. There's no way to cross reference this information anyway. The reason why South Korea's system works so well is because they use their SSN which is a unique identifier.

    Again with the 'perfect system' argument. Just because phone numbers and ID's can be spoofed, doesn't mean we should dump it in the bin. Phone services are less convenient than email, why else have other tech giants maintained phone verification if it was such a weak barrier? A few cheats slipping in the crack is no excuse to discard a feasible solution.
    LilyflowerFuhreak
  • pepepepe
    Reactions: 2,125
    Posts: 161
    Member
    edited November 2018
    Didn't KMS abandon their SSN identification system?

  • FuhreakFuhreak
    Reactions: 6,920
    Posts: 1,283
    Member, Private Tester
    edited November 2018
    ShadEight wrote: »

    Please, every kid I know has a phone now. If you're too young for a phone, you're too young for an online video game. And if you have a computer, then you must certainly have a phone number. It's a legitimate verification process that companies are moving to, the problem is that GMS is a global service and is thus a little tricky to implement such a verification system.

    And none of the ones I know do. Some parents actually care about their kids having cell phones you know. Family shared PCs are still a thing.
    Yes it's old school, but that doesn't mean there aren't still people doing it. I didn't own a cell phone by choice until I was 26.
    The only reason I do is because someone else gave it to me. I've owned my own computers since 14.

    Now as far as being a legitimate verification process, I'll agree with that on the most part. That doesn't mean I can't still hate it.
    It's intrusive when done incorrectly. I shouldn't have to grab my phone every time I want to login to something. (Which a lot of companies force.)
    Should Nexon go down this path to combat bots, I'll agree to it for registration only.
  • BBQTimeBBQTime
    Reactions: 1,080
    Posts: 44
    Member
    edited November 2018
    ShadEight wrote: »
    Fuhreak wrote: »
    Absolutely not.
    There are plenty of people who do not have phones, including children.
    Making this a requirement blocks people from playing the game.
    This is punishment to legit players for something hackers are doing.

    Please, every kid I know has a phone now. If you're too young for a phone, you're too young for an online video game. And if you have a computer, then you must certainly have a phone number. It's a legitimate verification process that companies are moving to, the problem is that GMS is a global service and is thus a little tricky to implement such a verification system.
    Asters wrote: »
    a better solution is IP ban for good period of time. which happens sometimes for people who try logging too many times fast .
    if you have an account with e-mail it needs phone verification already.
    It's no bad having multiple accounts what's worrying is certain IP, locations keep accessing the game after having a previous account blocked permanently.
    i say give them 3 chances if they consume it all. then a total IP block happens forever.

    Firstly emails only ask for phone numbers after the first creation by the same IP (this is true for gmail at least). Secondly IP banning is by far the easiest thing to circumvent, all you need to do is reset the router and automatically have the DHCP give you a new IP. And since accounts are not tied to IP (or else we couldn't play at our friends house etc), its job done for the exploiters who probably have their own system of quick IP switching anyway.

    Unfortunately, phone numbers can be spoofed and ID's can be counterfeited. There's no way to cross reference this information anyway. The reason why South Korea's system works so well is because they use their SSN which is a unique identifier.

    Again with the 'perfect system' argument. Just because phone numbers and ID's can be spoofed, doesn't mean we should dump it in the bin. Phone services are less convenient than email, why else have other tech giants maintained phone verification if it was such a weak barrier? A few cheats slipping in the crack is no excuse to discard a feasible solution.

    Haha, this is exactly what I was thinking.

    My mother is a teacher, and shes dealing with very young kids (around 6-7 years old) and she said that literally every single one of them has a phone (iPhone, etc)
    Also said that many of them has expensive phones.
  • ACMBlackCipherACMBlackCipher
    Reactions: 1,690
    Posts: 104
    Member
    edited November 2018
    ShadEight wrote: »

    Again with the 'perfect system' argument. Just because phone numbers and ID's can be spoofed, doesn't mean we should dump it in the bin. Phone services are less convenient than email, why else have other tech giants maintained phone verification if it was such a weak barrier? A few cheats slipping in the crack is no excuse to discard a feasible solution.

    It's not a "perfect system argument" nor is it a suggestion to just dump it. You seem to be rather passionate about this idea, to the point where any observed flaw in a system is seen as an immediate rejection?

    The point here is that this is a proposed solution to hackers. Another layer of ineffectiveness is still ineffective no matter how many times you layer it. If anything, it's a worthwhile addition to account security in the form of 2-Factor Auth.
  • ShadEightShadEight
    Reactions: 3,110
    Posts: 381
    Member
    edited November 2018
    ShadEight wrote: »

    Again with the 'perfect system' argument. Just because phone numbers and ID's can be spoofed, doesn't mean we should dump it in the bin. Phone services are less convenient than email, why else have other tech giants maintained phone verification if it was such a weak barrier? A few cheats slipping in the crack is no excuse to discard a feasible solution.

    It's not a "perfect system argument" nor is it a suggestion to just dump it. You seem to be rather passionate about this idea, to the point where any observed flaw in a system is seen as an immediate rejection?

    The point here is that this is a proposed solution to hackers. Another layer of ineffectiveness is still ineffective no matter how many times you layer it. If anything, it's a worthwhile addition to account security in the form of 2-Factor Auth.

    Any system has its flaws, there will never be a magic wand that wipes out 99% of hackers, even KMS has botters despite their SSN identifier. However calling it 'ineffective' because it still lets in hackers is just lazy. Virtual phone services (such as VoIP numbers) are not easy to maintain. That is why most (if not all) call forwarding/messaging services require fees and subscription. Prepaid SIMs will also expire if they are unused so buying your way to continue playing will hurt monetarily. If hackers are going to sustain a phone verification system then they're going to have to pay for the extra bandwidth.

    The point is to deter players from botting by slowing it down and making it expensive. People have to get out of this 'all or nothing' mentality, its unproductive and unrealistic.
  • Mercedes4Ever31Mercedes4Ever31
    Reactions: 1,215
    Posts: 69
    Member
    edited November 2018
    Fuhreak wrote: »
    ShadEight wrote: »

    Please, every kid I know has a phone now. If you're too young for a phone, you're too young for an online video game. And if you have a computer, then you must certainly have a phone number. It's a legitimate verification process that companies are moving to, the problem is that GMS is a global service and is thus a little tricky to implement such a verification system.

    And none of the ones I know do. Some parents actually care about their kids having cell phones you know. Family shared PCs are still a thing.
    Yes it's old school, but that doesn't mean there aren't still people doing it. I didn't own a cell phone by choice until I was 26.
    The only reason I do is because someone else gave it to me. I've owned my own computers since 14.

    Now as far as being a legitimate verification process, I'll agree with that on the most part. That doesn't mean I can't still hate it.
    It's intrusive when done incorrectly. I shouldn't have to grab my phone every time I want to login to something. (Which a lot of companies force.)
    Should Nexon go down this path to combat bots, I'll agree to it for registration only.

    Even if you're right, the amount of kids who doesn't have phone is very very low, especially compared to those who suffer due hackers...

    Do you have any idea how many people suffer due to hackers? and what about the entire economy that's also messed up due to hackers?

    If we had at least 50% less hackers, the economy could be so much better than it is now!

    And yet, you're saying that we shouldn't do this phone number thingy, just because of a very few kids without a phone??
    I really hope you're not being serious right now...

    Who's more important? the overwhelming majority (we're also the ones who spent over 5k+ on this game, in other words, thanks to us the game is still running, what would those kids without phones would do without us?? how much money have they spent on this game? 10 bucks? I'm myself spent over 9k, how about them?)
    Or, no offense, but just some very few kids with no phones...?

    Also in case you're responding to my message, please be very realistic and come up with some really logic respond that makes perfect sense. talk logic to me.
    Although it's perfectly fine to admit mistakes, we're all human beings.
  • FuhreakFuhreak
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    Posts: 1,283
    Member, Private Tester
    edited November 2018
    -snip-

    I already explained my reasons. I even said I would be okay with it in the post you quoted. Please re-read my posts.
    Now as far as being a legitimate verification process, I'll agree with that on the most part. That doesn't mean I can't still hate it.
    It's intrusive when done incorrectly. I shouldn't have to grab my phone every time I want to login to something. (Which a lot of companies force.)
    Should Nexon go down this path to combat bots, I'll agree to it for registration only.
    This can also be applied to people who have phones. I'm not giving my phone number to Nexon. They can't have it.