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No more spirit to play after so many nerf...

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  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
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    edited October 2016
    KMS summer update are our winter updates, and it's already been confirmed 5th job is coming out this winter for the other MS regions, including GMS. Also KMS winter updates are our summer updates.
    SkyTheDestroyer
  • ZephyrusSpringZephyrusSpring
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    edited October 2016
    TimeKarma
    TimeKarma said:

    They needed to add CD to our Sweeping Staff, you very well know how overpowered it was to spam Finishing Blow + Sweeping Staff. Battle Mage was always to be an upfront mage fighter (hence the name Battle Mage), Finishing Blow + Sweeping Staff doesn't fit that upfront mage fighter that Nexon originally plan for the class.
    While we're talking about nerfs let's talk about the buffs when the revamp happened. Combat Teleport is easily one of the best teleport in game because of how it works. Dark Genesis DID NOT GET NERFED, it went from 1075%x2 to 520%x8 that's almost doubling in damage. You're now able to teleport while in animation for Finishing Blow while you couldn't before. Our Bossing now is better due to our mobility and how well our skills work together as a whole. The reaper turn into something way more useful for everything and you get it from 1st job and it only keeps improving as you level further. Also one more thing that's been buffed, that would be our Aura range with party members. I'm a sucker for team play and that helps with team play a lot. They have few active buffs now and a lot of toggle skills which is great since you can just cast Staff Boost + Maple Warrior and not much time lost to buff (or just Staff Boost because Maple Warrior lasts 15 minutes). The whole revamp just improve Battle Mage class as a whole and I can't stress that enough.
    Do you think previous Battle Mage with many skill delays will be able to compete with our current Battle Mage? I don't think so and allow me to show you a Battle Mage's Chaos Vellum Solo from Korea's V Update.

    This is near or at peak performance, previous Battle Mage version can't match the damage of the current Battle Mage. Sure this may not be looking all too fancy for other classes but this is very impressive for Battle Mage.

    They're a mage that fights upfront with little delays in skills.
    But hey if you don't enjoy the class, simply don't play it.
    That's a copout response. Any class can be as strong or weak as any other class coz it only takes a few number changes. Saying the current battle mage is the best one because it has the highest theoretical dps is weak reasoning. The various revamps battle mages have received has completely changed the playstyle. They're not the same class as they used to be and that's what Arwen is complaining about.
    Back in the day when our teleport had hyper upgrades I picked the luminous-style invincibility one because telecasting doesn't work at 600 ping. Take it from me, the class isn't any stronger than pre-GLA when you're not telecasting. I can't speak for Arwen, but when I say I'd like to see bits from the old Battle Mage come back I'm talking about the first rendition. Body Boost, Twister, Reapers, etc. It's clear that a lot of people do enjoy the telecasting playstyle (you see it on reddit more than here) so ideally they should bring back the rock revamp and make a new class branch out of it.

    My 2c from a BaM vet.
  • TempchonTempchon
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    edited October 2016
    ZephyrusSpring

    That's a copout response. Any class can be as strong or weak as any other class coz it only takes a few number changes. Saying the current battle mage is the best one because it has the highest theoretical dps is weak reasoning. The various revamps battle mages have received has completely changed the playstyle. They're not the same class as they used to be and that's what Arwen is complaining about.
    Back in the day when our teleport had hyper upgrades I picked the luminous-style invincibility one because telecasting doesn't work at 600 ping. Take it from me, the class isn't any stronger than pre-GLA when you're not telecasting. I can't speak for Arwen, but when I say I'd like to see bits from the old Battle Mage come back I'm talking about the first rendition. Body Boost, Twister, Reapers, etc. It's clear that a lot of people do enjoy the telecasting playstyle (you see it on reddit more than here) so ideally they should bring back the rock revamp and make a new class branch out of it.

    My 2c from a BaM vet.
    But they're not just saying that current BaM is the best version because of only DPS, but also mechanics. BaMs core play style has barely changed at all as TimeKarma pointed out. Basically the only nerfs BaMs have had is BKBs cooldown, which just made the skill actually be on par with the other similar 170 hyper skill, instead of it being a mindless spam skill. I mean if nerfing us means when go from being low on the DPS charts to being in or near top 10, then please KMS "nerf" us more :]
    As for what Arwen is complaining about, it just seems like a case of nostalgia clouding them from seeing what BaMs really are. (My favourite part is when they said that Battle burst is a useless skill, when it is very much an essential movement skill, while wanting the old dark shock - which was actually completely useless outside of 3rd job - back).

    We really don't need skills like Body Boost or GLA back. Looking back on them, our complete reliance on those two skills crippled us if we ever died and they weren't already off cooldown. Not to mention GLA in itself actually did change one part of the BaM playstyle - sharing auras with party members. Anyways 5th job union aura is essentially the replacement to these skills, without making us overly dependent on them for DPS, as were are still very capable without it active. The old reaper was literal trash even when training, and twister spin would have to be like phantom's tempest to even be useful. I wouldn't be against making a separate class branch with the scrapped BaM revamp (which really only got scrapped beacause of bandwagoners and their "muh BKB" -_- )

    On a side note: pls KMS give us new blow animations already -_-

    TimeKarmaPikarie
  • ZephyrusSpringZephyrusSpring
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    edited October 2016
    The BaM play style has changed tremendously, who are you trying to kid? The saw blade follow up attack was removed and replaced with sweeping staff, which was in turn given a cooldown because it was op. Twister spin was nerfed to be stationary like Phantom's and then later removed. You say twister spin was useless, but I used it as an instant full heal. It'll never be what it once was though now that Nexon has cracked down on lifesteal so unfortunately I'll have to let it go.

    Reapers were trash in low density maps and most bosses, but in high density spawns their damage output was great. For example in commerci if a boss spawned right after an endless wave you could get similar bonus damage to what the current one gives. All they had to do was make it a chance to summon [i]on hit[/i] instead of on kill and it would have been fine.

    I hated GLA because it removed our core party play, I'm glad it's gone and hope they never try it again. Same with union aura, the whole point of having multiple auras is to stance dance, not cheap out and get every buff at once. I'm really disappointed to see it returning.

    The whole point of body boost having a cooldown was so that it couldn't be on all the time. When they increased to duration to be longer than the cooldown its only down time was when you died. You're supposed to time your usage of the skill for maximum effect, like waiting until after Hilla's damage reflection wore off.

    But at the core of the issue, the emphasis on telecasting is what killed the class for me. It makes up a huge amount of the class' damage and I simply couldn't do it reliably playing from Australia. I haven't had a go since they supposedly reduced the lag but even still, I mained the class for the follow up attack play style (kinda like blaster but without the charge attack nonsense) and the stance dancing, and I'm really annoyed that both have been been removed.
  • thrakkesthrakkes
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    edited October 2016
    Jorjax
    Jorjax said:

    Arwen
    Arwen said:

    I laid rest my Lumi because it's slow and now they nerf the teleport...one of Luminous speciality
    I laid rest my Evan after the nerf
    I laid rest my Bishop , because it's useful for HS only
    I laid rest my Kaiser because of nerf
    I laid rest Kanna, because it's usefull for Kishin only
    I still only play my Battle Mage... It was once has a very good skill (Union Aura) , but they nerfed alot...3 times they have nerfed BAM. They take away the twister, they change some skill and add a new useless skil. If they nerfed it again..then i will rest for good..and will hybernate until Nexon learn from their mistake and they accept that every class has some special skills that others don't have. And i see how they hate Magician class alot .
    Let's see...

    Lumi = Exceptional amazing Bosser/Farmer
    Bishop = Exceptional amazing farmer with low cooldown AoE + Bossing (Future Lucid)
    Kaiser = Ranked 2nd in KMS DPS Chart.
    Kanna = The only class that can use both 4x Fafnir set + X amount of SW set due to Haku's weapon slot...? Who's as close as Zero double potential weapons/stats? Wow?
    BM = It's fine as it is... >_>

    Now, let compared all your classes that you play with mine....

    -Hero-
    1) Nerf Multiple-times until their Raging blow isn't as good as it used to be (required 1.2x amount of funding to hit cap again).
    2) Mid-Long cooldown AoE skills (Shout and Hyper typically) + Slow animation.
    3) Crappy attack animation (regarding of both 1h and 2h attack speed).
    4) Only has 1 main attack through all job advancements.
    5) Sitting at the bottom of KMS DPS Chart.
    6) Useless 5th job skill (Summon soul? Why not give us a shadow-partner like instead?).
    7) Half-slow animation for Dash (Even with 0 Attack Speed Break cap).
    8) Useless combo skill orbs? Compared to Paladin and Dark Knight who can hit 100% potential of their damage?
    9) Panic + Puncture required to kill cap unless you have ton of $$$/Times to replace this. (Regarding of hitting cap without it).

    I can go on if you like. I don't see what's wrong with the current Lumi and other classes except for Hero (The only explorer class that haven't receive much buff other than their main attack?).

    I don't know for you, but I have an opposite opinion on Hero, I also main this class. Also, I dont get why KMS are buffing some classes very crazy in 5th job patch. I only notice some minor nerfs.

    First, Raging Blow was never really nerfed EXCEPT for the extra +10% damage we could receive if being in Enrage Mode, that was before Reboot patch. But got compensated for dealing 2 extra lines on Enraged mode then Hyper Stats system.
    2) Shout is nerfed, but WAY stronger, but don't forget Hyper Skill Rising Rage got buffed a lot for faster casting and lower cooldown from 30 to 10 sec.
    3) Guess I don't care much of attack animations. Enrage look is very nice for me.
    4) This can be boring, but I like play simple plus with Hero mechanism.
    5) Again, Idk why KMS did some weird class buffing but not getting Hero stronger o-0 But note that Hero does constant damage.
    6) Can be a good skill if we find spot to release the summon so it can hit stronger and for very long time.
    7) I find Hero ruse very good, GREATER distance compared to Paladin and DrK and it's fast at hardcap attack speed ( i hit hard cap myself)
    8) Again, more constant damage than DrK and Paladin. Panic darkness status last 40 sec on boss and Puncture DoT lasts 30 sec, they are also nice dmg boost.
    9) In old time, having fewer lines means lowest DPS if capping.

    In old time, AFA and crit damage were bugged and doing 6 lines. Now, AFA works very good and crit damage too. And now doing 11.5 hits (10 from enraged raging blow + 75% chance of 2x250% from AFA) Even with Enrage nerf, critical damage fix doesnt change DPS, it INCREASES A LOT IF GETTING A TON OF CRIT RATE!!
  • TempchonTempchon
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    edited October 2016
    ZephyrusSpring

    The BaM play style has changed tremendously, who are you trying to kid? The saw blade follow up attack was removed and replaced with sweeping staff, which was in turn given a cooldown because it was op. Twister spin was nerfed to be stationary like Phantom's and then later removed. You say twister spin was useless, but I used it as an instant full heal. It'll never be what it once was though now that Nexon has cracked down on lifesteal so unfortunately I'll have to let it go.

    Reapers were trash in low density maps and most bosses, but in high density spawns their damage output was great. For example in commerci if a boss spawned right after an endless wave you could get similar bonus damage to what the current one gives. All they had to do was make it a chance to summon [i]on hit[/i] instead of on kill and it would have been fine.

    I hated GLA because it removed our core party play, I'm glad it's gone and hope they never try it again. Same with union aura, the whole point of having multiple auras is to stance dance, not cheap out and get every buff at once. I'm really disappointed to see it returning.

    The whole point of body boost having a cooldown was so that it couldn't be on all the time. When they increased to duration to be longer than the cooldown its only down time was when you died. You're supposed to time your usage of the skill for maximum effect, like waiting until after Hilla's damage reflection wore off.

    But at the core of the issue, the emphasis on telecasting is what killed the class for me. It makes up a huge amount of the class' damage and I simply couldn't do it reliably playing from Australia. I haven't had a go since they supposedly reduced the lag but even still, I mained the class for the follow up attack play style (kinda like blaster but without the charge attack nonsense) and the stance dancing, and I'm really annoyed that both have been been removed.
    I see the problem here is that we simply see different things as being the BaM playstyle - you as follow-up attacks, and me as being up close and having quick attacks - so I can sorta see why you think the BaM playstyle has changed so much.

    Even in commerci, since the reaper duration was low enough they could easily not even be able to attack a boss after a mob wave. Not to mention their dumb AI...

    The thing with union aura was that we first had it when we could use all our auras at once anyways, so stance dancing wasn't even a thing anyway. As for the 5th job union aura, it is more like the original body boost - a temporary significant boost - than it is the original union aura.

    Which btw, where are you getting that stance dancing was removed? Considering that we've been able to stack auras ever since one of the very first BaM changes after introduction iirc and until the current iteration of BaM. For current BaM, aura swapping is essential to gaining optimal damage output, at the very least, more than ever.

  • ZephyrusSpringZephyrusSpring
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    edited October 2016
    As for the 5th job union aura, it is more like the original body boost - a temporary significant boost - than it is the original union aura.
    I didn't read the fine print closely enough to notice the cooldown on the new union aura. That's somewhat acceptable I guess.
    Which btw, where are you getting that stance dancing was removed? Considering that we've been able to stack auras ever since one of the very first BaM changes after introduction iirc and until the current iteration of BaM. For current BaM, aura swapping is essential to gaining optimal damage output, at the very least, more than ever.
    My comment about aura swapping being removed was in response to the upcomming union aura which I've now found isn't an always-on thing. One good thing about the latest revamp was that they went back to the class' roots in relation to auras. I've been around since the start. Before they changed the visual effect of the auras, when twister spin made you invincible, when Battle Rage didn't exist.
  • KingDragonKingDragon
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    edited October 2016
    Wow...

    and here i was bummed out that my (DK Job) Dark Eye's time got cut from 5min to 3min
    so now all my other buff are at 5min except that one