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Add a "Not for Sale" option for Free Market Shops

Its2Sharp4UIts2Sharp4U
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Posts: 881
Member
edited March 2017 in Suggestions, Feedback, and Requests
We all know the current max mesos is 10 billion. However people nowadays still do high value trades regardless due to the massively inflated market by hackers where the permanent unrecoverable damage has been done.

Some people use Permit/Hired Merchant Shops requires to have the item set at it's max value but with some mesos with it so it cannot be bought so then possible players will bid on the item.

However, the potential problem with setting a high value item above the mesos cap in is when they clean out shop or forget to put some mesos aside allowing the item to be unintentionally purchasable.

In order to combat this there should be a "Not for Sale" option when using Permit/Hired Merchant Shops which allows the seller to display the item but not actually sell the item.
BIackbeanFennekinKlara
  1. Do you agree with this suggestion?22 votes
    1. Yes.
       36% (8 votes)
    2. No.
       64% (14 votes)

Comments

  • SlicedTimeSlicedTime
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    Member
    edited March 2017
    I think they shoul just increase the meso cap.
    Kylehell007
  • AggraphineAggraphine
    Reactions: 19,405
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    Member
    edited March 2017
    SlicedTime wrote: »
    I think they shoul just increase the meso cap.

    Which serves no purpose but to move the bar ahead by a little bit.

    To expand, in raising the meso cap, you only exacerbate the issue. Take these so-proclaimed problems we have with a meso cap of 9,999,999,999. Now double the meso cap. That doubles the problem. Triple it, problems increase again. Quadruple it? Same deal. Increasing the meso cap will simply pull most things well out of the reach of people who do not already have max mesos on multiple characters + storage. Everything will just end up costing more. People will still list items for max meso, be that 20, 30 or even 40 billion mesos, and invariably someone will be capable of buying it for that amount, which then sets us off down the exact same path, but magnitudes worse than it currently is.


    Of course, knowing the top-tier quality of some people who post here, someone is bound to come and tell me all the harebrained, imaginary ways in which I am wrong, as if banking on the absolute certainty that no one would ever buy an item listed for max mesos if the meso cap was 30 billion or more.
  • bumbertyrbumbertyr
    Reactions: 6,400
    Posts: 1,167
    Nexon
    edited March 2017
    increasing the meso cap allows botters to hold more which in turn inflates the economy, we'd end up back where we started :/.
  • BIackbeanBIackbean
    Reactions: 3,450
    Posts: 519
    Member
    edited March 2017
    yes i agree, add a function so that an item can never be sold even if it's in the shop! Since, you don't want to accidentally sell an item that you never planned on selling for max mesos
  • BIackbeanBIackbean
    Reactions: 3,450
    Posts: 519
    Member
    edited March 2017
    Also if such was implemented then this case of my friend would never had happened

    http://www.basilmarket.com/Definition-of-Scamming-Thread-b5Lvl-3#comments

    "So recently my friend was asked to reset his shop since someone wanted to purchase an item but the shop had mesos in it. My friend cleans the shop but realizes too late that his top item that he did not want to sell for 10b was now buyable. The "buyer" then quickly snipes the 10b item and now my friend lost an item that was worth more than 10b.

    The buyer played this trick multiples times on different people and successful with some and not with others, but victims of this method are not brave enough or willing to take a broad interpretation to consider this as a scam.

    Does my friend have the right to call him a scammer?"
  • xNailKaiserxNailKaiser
    Reactions: 2,165
    Posts: 107
    Member
    edited March 2017
    Raising the meso cap isn't solving a problem, it's only worsening it. What they need to do is add a max price for any item listed. Add multipliers for any type of enhancements done and then cap the prices of items.

    You want to ruin the scammers, hackers, and botters who have destroyed the economy of the Free Market, then destroy their only means of survival... the prices. Vindictus does this to some extent with their marketplace and it has helped greatly. Yes it would cause a market panic at first, but over time it will stabilize trades and prevent abuse of the free market.

    And now to wait and see how many people cry foul, how I'm out to wreck people's lives, ruin MapleStory, etc. LOL
  • Its2Sharp4UIts2Sharp4U
    Reactions: 5,805
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    Member
    edited March 2017
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    SlicedTime wrote: »
    I think they shoul just increase the meso cap.

    Which serves no purpose but to move the bar ahead by a little bit.

    To expand, in raising the meso cap, you only exacerbate the issue. Take these so-proclaimed problems we have with a meso cap of 9,999,999,999. Now double the meso cap. That doubles the problem. Triple it, problems increase again. Quadruple it? Same deal. Increasing the meso cap will simply pull most things well out of the reach of people who do not already have max mesos on multiple characters + storage. Everything will just end up costing more. People will still list items for max meso, be that 20, 30 or even 40 billion mesos, and invariably someone will be capable of buying it for that amount, which then sets us off down the exact same path, but magnitudes worse than it currently is.


    Of course, knowing the top-tier quality of some people who post here, someone is bound to come and tell me all the harebrained, imaginary ways in which I am wrong, as if banking on the absolute certainty that no one would ever buy an item listed for max mesos if the meso cap was 30 billion or more.

    This is one if not several reasons why I'm not pushing towards this direction. This mainly benefits the top percentage of merchants and hackers instead of actual regular players.
    Raising the meso cap isn't solving a problem, it's only worsening it. What they need to do is add a max price for any item listed. Add multipliers for any type of enhancements done and then cap the prices of items.

    You want to ruin the scammers, hackers, and botters who have destroyed the economy of the Free Market, then destroy their only means of survival... the prices. Vindictus does this to some extent with their marketplace and it has helped greatly. Yes it would cause a market panic at first, but over time it will stabilize trades and prevent abuse of the free market.

    And now to wait and see how many people cry foul, how I'm out to wreck people's lives, ruin MapleStory, etc. LOL

    In my honest opinion, that was rather interesting to bring up. I've heard a few stories how Vindictus has changed time and time again by adding in new gears and outclassing the old which makes them cheaper. One of the main features of the market is that certain items can't be sold again on the market such as materials (or does it apply to all items?).

    It helps with progression and power-creep which I am for since we can only move forward right? We have had Tyrant for 4-5 years and Chaos Root Abyss for 3-4 years now. The current problem is that Absolab and Arcane Umbra is currently insanely hard to obtain and Lv.160+ gears do not benefit greatly for the reason of not having 16-25 Star Force expansion.

    Also with the funding structure not being so kind in terms of free-to-play which causes an imbalance to an extent to Legendary Potential, Bonus Potential, and Nebulites. It might be an accessibility issue for all sorts of items to be costly within the market beyond the bound of max mesos. Increasing access will lower prices which can be a solution to eliminating the item max mesos problem while making more items affordable for the average player.
  • CatoooloooCatooolooo
    Reactions: 5,625
    Posts: 1,213
    Member
    edited March 2017
    the thing is Nexon do not intend for people to sell items over the meso cap, and they do not wish to encourage it, so its risky trading and selling is also somewhat intended to persuade you to do otherwise.

    the stalls are not even being used the intended way (which is more of a failure/early programing failure than an exploit) and were not intended to make shops for items on display only.

    they could probably change it so that meso overflow goes to fredric for holding, but I bet the only reason they have yet to do that is because they are scared of breaking the delicate FM system code and maybe open up an exploit for meso duping.
  • AznboiEAznboiE
    Reactions: 3,445
    Posts: 519
    Member
    edited March 2017
    BIackbean wrote: »
    Does my friend have the right to call him a scammer?"

    lol no that's just stubborn idiocy to blame someone else for your own mistakes.

    Very much like some of the Liberals that blame Russia's "relations" to Trump in the election for Hillary's loss with no valid proof and just thowing false accusations like some of us maplers, including my self, do from time to time.
    I hate to get political but it's a good reference to what your friend considers as a "scammer".

    Nexon should catfish & ban the players who are trying to sell items for more than meso cap because I guarantee what they're really after is real or micro-transaction currency (NX).
  • AK712AK712
    Reactions: 1,730
    Posts: 114
    Member
    edited March 2017
    Seriously?

    In a shop + In a map designed for buying/selling + in Free Market = should have option not to sell?

    How about this (and here's a real novel idea): DON'T PUT IT IN THE SHOP?

    If you don't want to sell something... you probably shouldn't sell it.
    Dough
  • FennekinFennekin
    Reactions: 2,941
    Posts: 471
    Member, Private Tester
    edited March 2017
    Catooolooo wrote: »
    the thing is Nexon do not intend for people to sell items over the meso cap, and they do not wish to encourage it, so its risky trading and selling is also somewhat intended to persuade you to do otherwise.

    The issue is that some items are clearly worth more than max mesos at the moment. Like, a lot more. It's pretty outrageous how much more than max mesos some items are worth lol. So owners of those items are forced to either use them, perform a trust-trade (be it nx codes, pp, or separate trades of max mesos), or trade them for items of equalish value.

    Something that's been suggested before is to have an item that can be converted to and from a denomination(s) of mesos (with a tax applied, of course). That way, if there's an item worth more than max mesos, the buyer can buy a bunch of those meso denomination items and trade them to the seller, who can them convert those items back into mesos. But I'm sure there are flaws with this approach that people have pointed out before as well.

  • AggraphineAggraphine
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    edited March 2017
    Fennekin wrote: »
    Something that's been suggested before is to have an item that can be converted to and from a denomination(s) of mesos (with a tax applied, of course). That way, if there's an item worth more than max mesos, the buyer can buy a bunch of those meso denomination items and trade them to the seller, who can them convert those items back into mesos. But I'm sure there are flaws with this approach that people have pointed out before as well.

    NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

    I bet you're wondering why, aren't you?


    Dupers. The instant you add some asinine "mega-currency item", you're going to have people duping the everloving hell out of them. And then every single world's economy goes straight into the shitter.
    Fennekin
  • FennekinFennekin
    Reactions: 2,941
    Posts: 471
    Member, Private Tester
    edited March 2017
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Fennekin wrote: »
    Something that's been suggested before is to have an item that can be converted to and from a denomination(s) of mesos (with a tax applied, of course). That way, if there's an item worth more than max mesos, the buyer can buy a bunch of those meso denomination items and trade them to the seller, who can them convert those items back into mesos. But I'm sure there are flaws with this approach that people have pointed out before as well.

    NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

    I bet you're wondering why, aren't you?


    Dupers. The instant you add some asinine "mega-currency item", you're going to have people duping the everloving hell out of them. And then every single world's economy goes straight into the shitter.

    Oh lul yeah, that's probably the reason people don't suggest this anymore xD. Would be hard for Nexon to track the duped mesos, too lol.

  • SlicedTimeSlicedTime
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    Member
    edited March 2017
    I'd like to preface this by telling you guys that I don't really have any experience with max meso trading. However, I see the current contrast between the meso cap and the price of "premium" items as a possible scam-vector. It is clear to me that the current market is not working as intended for whatever reason.

    Aggraphine wrote: »
    SlicedTime wrote: »
    I think they shoul just increase the meso cap.

    Which serves no purpose but to move the bar ahead by a little bit.

    To expand, in raising the meso cap, you only exacerbate the issue. Take these so-proclaimed problems we have with a meso cap of 9,999,999,999. Now double the meso cap. That doubles the problem. Triple it, problems increase again. Quadruple it? Same deal. Increasing the meso cap will simply pull most things well out of the reach of people who do not already have max mesos on multiple characters + storage. Everything will just end up costing more. People will still list items for max meso, be that 20, 30 or even 40 billion mesos, and invariably someone will be capable of buying it for that amount, which then sets us off down the exact same path, but magnitudes worse than it currently is.


    Of course, knowing the top-tier quality of some people who post here, someone is bound to come and tell me all the harebrained, imaginary ways in which I am wrong, as if banking on the absolute certainty that no one would ever buy an item listed for max mesos if the meso cap was 30 billion or more.
    Obviously just multiplying the cap by 10 or so wouldn't solve the problem, since there are items worth hundreds of billions of mesos. That means meso cap should probably be around the trillions.

    bumbertyr wrote: »
    increasing the meso cap allows botters to hold more which in turn inflates the economy, we'd end up back where we started :/.
    Wouldn't the gold farmers just make new characters/accounts for holding more mesos regardless? Sure, managing a 1000 characters is more difficult than managing 10 characters, but how big of an issue is that to gold farmers when they just automate the whole process? This is a bit of a shot in the dark and some-what tangential to the topic, but wouldn't the whole problem with gold farmers stop if people just stopped buying mesos? I recon it could be discouraged by setting trade restrictions to new and low level characters / accounts as well as by monitoring high-meso trades.
    Kylehell007
  • Kylehell007Kylehell007
    Reactions: 1,295
    Posts: 142
    Member
    edited March 2017
    SlicedTime wrote: »
    I'd like to preface this by telling you guys that I don't really have any experience with max meso trading. However, I see the current contrast between the meso cap and the price of "premium" items as a possible scam-vector. It is clear to me that the current market is not working as intended for whatever reason.

    Aggraphine wrote: »
    SlicedTime wrote: »
    I think they shoul just increase the meso cap.

    Which serves no purpose but to move the bar ahead by a little bit.

    To expand, in raising the meso cap, you only exacerbate the issue. Take these so-proclaimed problems we have with a meso cap of 9,999,999,999. Now double the meso cap. That doubles the problem. Triple it, problems increase again. Quadruple it? Same deal. Increasing the meso cap will simply pull most things well out of the reach of people who do not already have max mesos on multiple characters + storage. Everything will just end up costing more. People will still list items for max meso, be that 20, 30 or even 40 billion mesos, and invariably someone will be capable of buying it for that amount, which then sets us off down the exact same path, but magnitudes worse than it currently is.


    Of course, knowing the top-tier quality of some people who post here, someone is bound to come and tell me all the harebrained, imaginary ways in which I am wrong, as if banking on the absolute certainty that no one would ever buy an item listed for max mesos if the meso cap was 30 billion or more.
    Obviously just multiplying the cap by 10 or so wouldn't solve the problem, since there are items worth hundreds of billions of mesos. That means meso cap should probably be around the trillions.

    bumbertyr wrote: »
    increasing the meso cap allows botters to hold more which in turn inflates the economy, we'd end up back where we started :/.
    Wouldn't the gold farmers just make new characters/accounts for holding more mesos regardless? Sure, managing a 1000 characters is more difficult than managing 10 characters, but how big of an issue is that to gold farmers when they just automate the whole process? This is a bit of a shot in the dark and some-what tangential to the topic, but wouldn't the whole problem with gold farmers stop if people just stopped buying mesos? I recon it could be discouraged by setting trade restrictions to new and low level characters / accounts as well as by monitoring high-meso trades.

    Most well thought out response on entire post. Just cause prices change or the meso cap is changed does NOT AT ALLLLLLLLL stop botters. If anything it helps them by being able to generate more amount of virtual income for resale. They will always be nearly one step ahead of the economy because its their actual full time jobs for most of them.
  • Kylehell007Kylehell007
    Reactions: 1,295
    Posts: 142
    Member
    edited March 2017
    Aggraphine wrote: »
    Fennekin wrote: »
    Something that's been suggested before is to have an item that can be converted to and from a denomination(s) of mesos (with a tax applied, of course). That way, if there's an item worth more than max mesos, the buyer can buy a bunch of those meso denomination items and trade them to the seller, who can them convert those items back into mesos. But I'm sure there are flaws with this approach that people have pointed out before as well.

    NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

    I bet you're wondering why, aren't you?


    Dupers. The instant you add some asinine "mega-currency item", you're going to have people duping the everloving hell out of them. And then every single world's economy goes straight into the shitter.

    And no dupers are not the true issue at hand since you think you know it all. Why would any business OVERFLOOD the market with dupes essentially destroying their own income. Nah. Keep wondering more. The smartest and most consistent hacker/dupers are STILL around after almost a decade because they're not so ignorant to the fact that if they dupe 100x an item at once ALL their revenue is demolished.
  • AznboiEAznboiE
    Reactions: 3,445
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    Member
    edited March 2017
    Fennekin wrote: »
    The issue is that some items are clearly worth more than max mesos at the moment.

    No, the issue is that people believe pixels obtained by spending real money is also worth real money when attempted to be sold, while in reality, those items are really worthless unless you're really going to believe Maplestory is going to be around forever and you will always be playing it.

    By saying something is worth more than the maximum currency obtainable per character, such means of obtaining said something is limited to being obtained by people who have obtained several "max meso" balances or by anti-ToS methods (the easier yet dumber choice). And once everyone who can afford one at those ridiculous prices no longer need those items, their value trickles down until the next class of players can buy them (anyone with max meso but no less).

    If people think paper with a number printed can withhold any value at all (referencing any currency made from "paper" (yes that includes our cotton-based bills) then it will have value to it, while if we all suddenly believed it was worthless, and it is, but not until our government or the "economy" declares it as worthless, then it will be worthless.

    So yes, if people actually had the belief that an LGR or frenzy totem is worth 500m, soon you will see people dropping their prices to that amount. But it's not until people become unwilling to pay more than max mesos that it will be so inexpensive.
  • Its2Sharp4UIts2Sharp4U
    Reactions: 5,805
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    edited March 2017
    AznboiE wrote: »
    Fennekin wrote: »
    The issue is that some items are clearly worth more than max mesos at the moment.

    No, the issue is that people believe pixels obtained by spending real money is also worth real money when attempted to be sold, while in reality, those items are really worthless unless you're really going to believe Maplestory is going to be around forever and you will always be playing it.

    By saying something is worth more than the maximum currency obtainable per character, such means of obtaining said something is limited to being obtained by people who have obtained several "max meso" balances or by anti-ToS methods (the easier yet dumber choice). And once everyone who can afford one at those ridiculous prices no longer need those items, their value trickles down until the next class of players can buy them (anyone with max meso but no less).

    If people think paper with a number printed can withhold any value at all (referencing any currency made from "paper" (yes that includes our cotton-based bills) then it will have value to it, while if we all suddenly believed it was worthless, and it is, but not until our government or the "economy" declares it as worthless, then it will be worthless.

    So yes, if people actually had the belief that an LGR or frenzy totem is worth 500m, soon you will see people dropping their prices to that amount. But it's not until people become unwilling to pay more than max mesos that it will be so inexpensive.

    Unless the rarity drops there's no way that's going to happen. Hackers/dupers and merchants control most of the markets and continue to sell it as higher than max mesos. There's also the ratio that people use (against the ToS) which weighs how "costly" the item is to measure the price of a Frenzy Totem or LGR depending on the amount of rolls which can easily equal to hundreds or thousands of dollars. Convert it down into mesos and now all of a sudden that's the price (an estimated 250 billion mesos, about 25 times higher than the 10 billion max mesos).

    There's also a problem with inflation of mesos since botters has devalued it ever since the beginning, which is why Marvel Machine items are so costly.

    I don't think it's just "belief".
  • AznboiEAznboiE
    Reactions: 3,445
    Posts: 519
    Member
    edited March 2017
    I don't think it's just "belief".

    Then explain how people can get scammed because they didn't know the item's value?

    If they believed an item is worth 500m because someone said it was 500m but couldn't find someone willing to pay more (or just didnt bother to price check) then they'd sell it for that much without realizing an item's "true" value which is beyond the max meso count that some people are actually willing to pay for. And if people are actually willing to pay 15b for your item you priced at 500m are you still going to sell it for 500m? Of course not, you're going to hike it up to 15b and get rid of 80% of the general consumer market and only cater to those who have beyond the riches to pay for rarity items.

    But let's not forget the fact that Supply and Demand plays a big roll in how this is possible. An item like a frenzy totem can only decrease in value in 2 or 3 ways. One is that when everyone who can afford to pay more than 10b for it, whether legitimately or with real currency, no longer need the item, the item's price will then fall to where people who only have 10b or less can afford one, until no one needs it and the item becomes garbage in price but this process takes forever. The second way is if Nexon makes a new Frenzy Totem that has better spawn rate than the old one. This way is forcing the item to devalue the item's price, but not by very much, because there is only a limited amount of the newer item available, which in turn does not get rid of the problem, it just moves the problem to a different item. That's why Empress items became so worthless once CRA equips became available. But it's also why CRA dropped in price so much because not enough people wanted to pay 500m for an equip that is in so little in demand after people who were willing to buy that item for 500m are no longer around, which is why your average CRA gear is now around 25m.
  • Its2Sharp4UIts2Sharp4U
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    edited March 2017
    AznboiE wrote: »
    I don't think it's just "belief".

    Then explain how people can get scammed because they didn't know the item's value?

    If they believed an item is worth 500m because someone said it was 500m but couldn't find someone willing to pay more (or just didnt bother to price check) then they'd sell it for that much without realizing an item's "true" value which is beyond the max meso count that some people are actually willing to pay for. And if people are actually willing to pay 15b for your item you priced at 500m are you still going to sell it for 500m? Of course not, you're going to hike it up to 15b and get rid of 80% of the general consumer market and only cater to those who have beyond the riches to pay for rarity items.

    But let's not forget the fact that Supply and Demand plays a big roll in how this is possible. An item like a frenzy totem can only decrease in value in 2 or 3 ways. One is that when everyone who can afford to pay more than 10b for it, whether legitimately or with real currency, no longer need the item, the item's price will then fall to where people who only have 10b or less can afford one, until no one needs it and the item becomes garbage in price but this process takes forever. The second way is if Nexon makes a new Frenzy Totem that has better spawn rate than the old one. This way is forcing the item to devalue the item's price, but not by very much, because there is only a limited amount of the newer item available, which in turn does not get rid of the problem, it just moves the problem to a different item. That's why Empress items became so worthless once CRA equips became available. But it's also why CRA dropped in price so much because not enough people wanted to pay 500m for an equip that is in so little in demand after people who were willing to buy that item for 500m are no longer around, which is why your average CRA gear is now around 25m.

    The general circle of supply and demand.

    The problem with introducing a new and better than Frenzy Totem without making methods to obtain it (or a lesser version) in-game through content that isn't through NX or trading will further stretch the spectrum of pay-to-win with little to no ways for free-to-play besides having a Kishin mule. Nexon has already killed Kishin mules by introducing special monsters that do 10% HP and Potion Lock on touch that spawn every 5 minutes.

    Another issue as I've said in previous threads is that we're lacking the 16-25 Star Force Expansion for Lv.160+ items. This would push power creep again, but it'll move some players towards Sweet water, Absolab, and Arcane Umbra equipment. Accessibility is also an issue for those equipment along with Bonus Potential and Nebulites when not including NX or trading.

    This still does not get rid of the hundred billions or trillions of mesos in Non-Reboot servers. With the existence of massive amounts of mesos it's own value becoming less and less are making more items inflate higher and higher.